|
Post by yoteforever on Sept 21, 2014 7:48:28 GMT -6
I was reading the post about the basketball recruits that were visiting USD this weekend, and a thought jumped into my mind. Kids are influenced by several things, and one of the top things they base their decision on is fan appreciation. A study was done for big time basketball programs, and the number one reason a top athlete chooses the school he does is because in his mind gives him the best opportunity to play in the NBA. That was number one. The second reason was they wanted to play where fans were impassioned, and in essence would be adored by the fan base. i.e. fan appreciation.
In football, at our level, if our Dome was totally loud and out of control during games, not only would our football team get an immediate benefit from it, but future recruits would see the passion fans have and want to play here as well. That goes for basketball recruits at a football game. That is going to be their first impression of what our fans are like.
My personal opinion was yesterday was better than it has been, but it could be a hell of a lot better. We really need to be loud at the right times, creating problems for opposing teams. At Montana, 26,000 screamed on third down to the point our kids could barely hear. That's a huge advantage. I'm not sure how we as a fan base get better, but I saw some former players in the crowd yesterday trying their best to get the crowd into it at key times in the game. Good for them. We could learn from them.
I would like for our athletic facilities to be a place teams hated coming to because of crowd noise. When that arena opens up I would like for it to be instantly a nightmare for opposing schools. And with the level of competition in The valley in football, good lord knows any advantage we can get outside of the players would be huge. Think about it, and let's make the Dome rock for Dakota Days.
|
|
|
Post by canislatrans on Sept 21, 2014 9:29:19 GMT -6
Well said, Yoteforever. You could see the players asking for more noise, and even Saeger in the victory formation, signaled to the crowd to get up! This was a big win for the guys, and the least we can do as Yotes fans is give the players support when they've worked so hard to earn it.
This program has been waiting for a signature win, (I'm not sure this was it, but close enough), to get the snowball rolling down hill. Hopefully, this will lead to bigger things, both for players and fans. And as Coach Glenn says, "Look out!"
|
|
|
Post by 94grad on Sept 21, 2014 10:26:53 GMT -6
Thanks yf for starting this thread. Let me preface this with: I always get turned around in the dome. So my references are from the perspective of sitting on the alumni side. Also, I'm not sure where the "season ticket" section is since I had season tickets last year on the left hand 30 yard line. This year my season tickets are on the right hand 25 yard line. Maybe the season ticket section is everything in between. Moving on...
The "left side" definitely seems louder. When people do stand and cheer, it's typically the fans in the middle and towards the left. At the WP game and yesterday, when we were on defense and it was third down. I'd immediately stand up and start yelling, waiting for my fellow "right siders" to chime in. Only a few would ever stand and yell. That is inexcusable. What kind of home field advantage is that? If anything, it's disheartening to the players and having the opposite effect!
Also, on the "right" side, I believe we had NAU pinned back inside the 5 yard line ?twice? Once for sure. This is a chance to yell and scream on ALL downs on defense! They're backed up on their goalline. Sacks, TFLs, fumbles, and picks lead to safeties and return/recovery TDs when the opposition is pinned back like that. Ie. points on the board for us! Thank goodness for the band on that side or there would've been very little distraction for the NAU offense.
As others have said, what can you do? Force people to cheer? Maybe the crowd noise was due to WP and NAU not being familiar foes. And, it wasn't D-Days or the in-state rivalry game. But if those are the only games we can get fired up for, we need to seriously examine ourselves (again, excluding everyone here who's reading this, which on some level makes these posts pointless) as a fan base.
And, yes, the student section as a whole got a D yesterday. Kudos to those who stayed. For those who left (and again are not reading this), do you think that inspires YOUR football team when you disappear half way through the game?
Now it's officially the wrong thread- but back to the game. I can't add much beyond what others like obc have already said. Iddings was a one man wrecking crew. Saeger's got that sneaky quickness to avoid sacks and extend the play. I don't think he's as far from Earl as many originally thought. Special teams graded out at an A-, only because of the muffed punt, which Shufford later made up for. Maybe Bergner's had a better game at some point, but I don't remember it.
|
|
|
Post by azsod73 on Sept 21, 2014 14:33:42 GMT -6
A part the of the crowd noise problem - lack there-of, is a lot of empty seats right in the middle of our prime seating sections. I am referring to the seats between the 45s, about mid way up the rows. We consistently have 15 to 20 open seats within a popcorn kernels toss from where we sit. Doesn't seem to matter who we are playing so I am guessing the seats must have been purchased by some corporate entity that doesn't bother to pass out tickets.
I know I have been guilty of not turning in unused tickets (that I haven't been able to give to someone who would enjoy the experience while wearing red and cheering on our Yotes), but this year I am making a concerted effort to make something good come of it. My tickets for the last three home games will be going to a Yote fan who has fallen back a bit and my goal is to have him buying his own tickets for next year. Hope it works.
|
|
|
Post by Iceman on Sept 21, 2014 22:39:02 GMT -6
You guys are all way too nice about the student section. To start with, the bleachers weren't full to start the game. Inexcusable. Then we build a 20-0 lead on a ranked team at halftime and the few that were there leave because in their eyes, the game is boring and its over anyway. The few that were left seemed disinterested and were only there so they can swipe their ID after the game so they can win something. All kids these days think they need to be given something if they are expected to do something. I guess I just don't understand the whole thing of being hammered all weekend long to the point that I can't stop drinking for 3 hours to go support the college I go to. The only noise I heard from the student section, especially in the second half were a few students beating against the chain link fence in the front row of the student bleachers.
I give the student section an F. It was a joke.
|
|
|
Post by yoteforever on Sept 22, 2014 7:03:59 GMT -6
I have come to the conclusion that it student involvement at games at USD is never going to happen unless we are playing SDSU. The first game I thought maybe we've turned the corner as the was a good crowd to start the game, and quite a few stayed after half until the game was put away. But Saturday painted the true picture, and I have to tell you, it isn't just USD. Student crowds at schools are down all across the country. Hell, even Nick Saben at Alabama got into hot water last year when he pleaded with to he kids to come support the Tide or give up their tickets to someone who would come.
Kids today are different. They don't have the loyalty or campus spirit like many of us did back in our days. To some degree, USD has always been what we called a "Ronnie run home" campus, with kids leaving on the weekend. I'm not even sure winning will fix the student issue. So he's my proposal, which is about as politically incorrect as it gets. No longer fight the trend. Begging them to come is stupid. Rewarding them or paying for a scholarship if your name is drawn is dumb. Simply take away their seats, and sell them at a discount to those that maybe feel full ticket price is a burden. I haven't given this a lot of thought, but in essence use the student tickets to lure new fans that aren't coming now, and provide them a GAMEDAY experience where they want to come back, and eventually join the Howling Pack and buy season tickets on he other side.
If they don't want to come by god let's accommodate them. Take away something they have, and just maybe then they'll realize the importance of the total college experience, and if not, we are generating revenue for the department. I know I'll hear the student fees argument, but again, all that is is just a politically correct argument in a situation that doesn't warrant the effort.
Lastly, we still have a long ways to go before is on the permanent side get passing grades for participation as well. We are all adults, we can figure out when the team needs an extremely noisy crowd to help disrupt our opponent or aid in the momentum of our team. Hell the kids were even pleading for noise several times Saturday. And I for one don't buy our crowd is older. The last time I looked, older people have two hands and a voice box as well. They are smart enough to don their Coyote apparel to the game, they can figure out when it's time to exercise and get off their duffs and make some noise. The sooner we can make the Dome a disastrous place to come and play, the sooner you will see the Coyotes in the playoffs. We are a small enough community that we can make this happen in a short period of time.
And many will think this is a joke, but I have suggested either having a Friday night session with coaches actually in a fun way "having a class on fan participation", or creating a YouTube film on the same topic. Obviously it's goofy as hell, but maybe it's so goofy that people would get the idea.
Make the Dome a hated place to play.
|
|
|
Post by wrj on Sept 22, 2014 7:22:16 GMT -6
Interesting thoughts about selling the students seats yfe. I have always suspected that student demographics play a significant role in student attendance. I suspect that it does. I have lived and attended high school games in both big towns and small towns. It seems that a larger percentage of the citizenry attend games in small towns. I have always attributed this to two factors. First, there is little else to do in the small towns. Second, the people in small towns are more likely to know the players on the team. I also suspect that the high school attendance habits of the students from small town schools follow a lot of them to college. Thus, the question, will student attendance at universities and colleges with more students from small high schools have better attendance at their games? Yoteforever mentioned both USD and SDSU in his post. Does anyone know if there is a significant difference in the demographics at these two schools with regard to size of the high school for the origin of the students?
I have a second thought. Is there a correlation between majors of the university student and whether or not they will attend games? Is a student in a natural science related major more likely to attend games than a business major? If so, does the USD list of majors have too many in which students are less likely to be interested in attending sporting events?
A third thought, and this one has come up before, involves simple numbers, and level of the students. USD has fewer undergraduate students and more graduate students, by ratio, than some (or all) of the other universities in South Dakota. I suspect, along with others, that the undergraduate student is far more likely to be the one to attend athletic events. Does this hurt attendance at USD?
Three thoughts is enough for me before 8:00 a.m. (M.D.T.).
|
|
|
Post by Yote 53 on Sept 22, 2014 10:31:49 GMT -6
I've given up trying to figure out the USD student body. Their turnout Saturday was no different than their turnout over the last 20+ years, pathetic. First thing that should happen is that any reference to "Coyote Crazies" should be taken down. No more banners, no more t-shirts. You students are not Coyotes and you are not Crazy, you are only non-existant. Funny part is as pathetic as the turnout was the student tailgate looked fantastic. I was all excited about turnout until gametime, then...ugh. To top it off I read the Volante last night and there is an article about students not being happy about the student tailgate. How it is smaller due to Arena construction and how it's Greek dominated, blah, blah, blah. Look kids, you never showed up for tailgates in years past, unless it was D-Days, or State. You expect to get this grand expanse of area to tailgate in? You should be happy with what you got because you certainly haven't EARNED it through your actions and participation. Nothing chaps me more than reading articles like that. The campus is beautiful now, new buildings everywhere, amenities galore. You know what I remember? I remember a boarded up Old Main, a 1950's B-school, a nondescript CSC, eating at the Commons, Julian Hall, and, wait, Wellness Center, what's that? USD students should be thankful for everything they have, including the fantastic athletic dept they have competing at an extremely high level in the best FCS conference in the country.
Oh, the atmosphere will be electric and the Dome will be packed in 3 weeks when we play UNI. It's the 100th D-Days. Of course it will be great. I wonder if our loyal students will make it past halftime though. They might miss something happening at Carey's, you know.
|
|
|
Post by yotemeal on Sept 22, 2014 12:40:50 GMT -6
Win and win consistently. That's what creates buy-in. And the winning needs to come first, before our students show up, stay and help our team win. Entertain. Game-day production needs to continue to improve. Calling students unappreciative and disloyal, while maybe true, won't get them to stay and create the environment we all want. People of all ages increasingly expect a lot from their surroundings at football games. I sort of thought we might turn the corner this year. Still largely unimpressed. Constant, effective engagement will help stem the tide of students leaving at halftime or not showing up period. I think it's a mistake not to listen to students unimpressed with tailgating accommodations. That's part of the equation. Don't be 75 degrees and sunny outside. That will take care of itself soon Alumni lead by example. Consider what those students see when they look across the field. I know that when I look to my left and right, I see a whole lot of people sitting with their arms crossed. I found it odd on Saturday how the Dome sounded exactly the same up 20 on a nationally ranked FCS team as it did when we were letting William Penn hang around. I can't decide whether our fan IQ is weak or we simply lack passion. Probably a combination, but I sadly lean toward the latter. We sure know when to get loud against SDSU. Opponents should fear the Dome as a gauntlet of noise and disruption. Instead, they're pretty much faced with one assault -- at the end of the game when all is on the line. Our fans do realize, I hope, that we can make noise throughout the game to prevent such scenarios. Maybe we just don't like to win comfortably?
|
|
|
Post by Yotes on Sept 22, 2014 12:44:31 GMT -6
I just graduated from the university in May, so this is my first time having to sit with the general public, and I dearly wish that I was still in the student section so that i wouldn't feel so out of place when I stand up and start screaming on every third down. Deride the students all you want, I was very vocal towards those who left at halftime during my time as a student, but I have to wonder if the fans who paid are only staying the whole game because they did have to pay for a ticket. It's so frustrating being the only person in my section who genuinely wants to make life hell for the opposition, it's so bad where I am at that I'm surprised that no one around me has asked me to sit down and be quiet.
The student section issue isn't even worth trying to figure out. Too many of the students are just looking for a party, school spirit has absolutely nothing to do with why they showed up in the first place. Their buzz wears off, the excitedment of being at the game wears off in the second quarter, then they leave at halftime to go sit around at the dorms or their apartments. And these kidis are absolutely shameless when confronted on the issue. I have been outside the Dome at halftime just to confront these kids, and I wish they wouldn't come to the games at all if they are going to leave halfway through.
Perhaps the problem is especially visible at USD because the students are all off on their own across the field.
|
|
|
Post by azsod73 on Sept 22, 2014 12:49:15 GMT -6
Interesting thoughts about selling the students seats yfe. I have always suspected that student demographics play a significant role in student attendance. I suspect that it does. I have lived and attended high school games in both big towns and small towns. It seems that a larger percentage of the citizenry attend games in small towns. I have always attributed this to two factors. First, there is little else to do in the small towns. Second, the people in small towns are more likely to know the players on the team. I also suspect that the high school attendance habits of the students from small town schools follow a lot of them to college. Thus, the question, will student attendance at universities and colleges with more students from small high schools have better attendance at their games? Yoteforever mentioned both USD and SDSU in his post. Does anyone know if there is a significant difference in the demographics at these two schools with regard to size of the high school for the origin of the students? I have a second thought. Is there a correlation between majors of the university student and whether or not they will attend games? Is a student in a natural science related major more likely to attend games than a business major? If so, does the USD list of majors have too many in which students are less likely to be interested in attending sporting events? A third thought, and this one has come up before, involves simple numbers, and level of the students. USD has fewer undergraduate students and more graduate students, by ratio, than some (or all) of the other universities in South Dakota. I suspect, along with others, that the undergraduate student is far more likely to be the one to attend athletic events. Does this hurt attendance at USD? Three thoughts is enough for me before 8:00 a.m. (M.D.T.). I agree on the demographics of the student pop.....what the hell, I agree with all your points.
|
|
obc
Senior Member
Posts: 781
|
Post by obc on Sept 22, 2014 13:37:37 GMT -6
I just graduated from the university in May, so this is my first time having to sit with the general public, and I dearly wish that I was still in the student section so that i wouldn't feel so out of place when I stand up and start screaming on every third down. Deride the students all you want, I was very vocal towards those who left at halftime during my time as a student, but I have to wonder if the fans who paid are only staying the whole game because they did have to pay for a ticket. It's so frustrating being the only person in my section who genuinely wants to make life hell for the opposition, it's so bad where I am at that I'm surprised that no one around me has asked me to sit down and be quiet. The student section issue isn't even worth trying to figure out. Too many of the students are just looking for a party, school spirit has absolutely nothing to do with why they showed up in the first place. Their buzz wears off, the excitedment of being at the game wears off in the second quarter, then they leave at halftime to go sit around at the dorms or their apartments. And these kidis are absolutely shameless when confronted on the issue. I have been outside the Dome at halftime just to confront these kids, and I wish they wouldn't come to the games at all if they are going to leave halfway through. Perhaps the problem is especially visible at USD because the students are all off on their own across the field. I think the AD would be smart to have about 50-100 seats all grouped together somewhere front and center in the alumni section and tell them their job is to be the most vocal in the stadium. I think if you had a large group like that it would be contagious and could easily grow to a thousand loud and boisterous folks. Even give them a name - perhaps The Real Coyote Crazies......
|
|
obc
Senior Member
Posts: 781
|
Post by obc on Sept 22, 2014 16:40:17 GMT -6
A buddy and I have discussed crowd noise and participation for hours. I think winning would really help and without some sustained success in the Win column we will struggle. Below are some of our ideas that we have discussed over the years (some better than others) - I am sure on this forum we could come up with some great ideas:
General ideas:
1. Have a regional HS marching band competition in the morning. The top two perform at halftime of the game. If we did this game after there are more seats installed on the upper level of the students side you could let all of the visiting bands set up where the students currently sit and push the students back behind them. If they all knew a few similar songs you could really make some noise. You would not only get hundreds of kids on USDs campus and at the game, most likely all of their parents would also buy tickets.
2. Theme nights- They have done a Halloween costume themed game in the past and the attendance was decent. You could do that or a variation every year. Do a Charlie - King of the Jungle night - students dress up as their favorite animals Throwback uniforms for the players was a good idea - we could have done a crowd throwback themed night. How about the team wears a vintage styled 1978 uniform to honor the championship team and have everyone in the crowd dress like the 70's. 70's music on the loudspeakers during pregame and breaks etc. ( I think you could actually get both the students and alumni involved in that. Could do a Coyotes at the Beach theme game - swim trunks , Hawaiian shirts optional for some, mandatory for fat guys like me...... I think students could really get behind that.
3. (Mentioned this one in a previous post) For the alumni section - start with 50-100 (depending on the demand) seats that are front and center that are designed to be the rowdy section. I think it could be an offshoot of Howling Pack and something that a group of people could really have fun with. Come up with a fun name, and make it our goal to get people excited and involved. My guess is people would get involved and respond. If you want to come and sit on your hands - there are plenty of seats (for now) they can sit and pretend they are at the library. We could keep track of how many offsides penalties the opposing team gets and make it our goal to get the other team to jump. The Dome could have a place where every time it happens it is recorded - kind of like strikeouts at a baseball game. I think that would be a blast and something everyone could get behind.
I am really looking forward to thoughts from the group. We can't just keep complaining - we need to find some ways to try and do something.
|
|
|
Post by yoteforever on Sept 22, 2014 19:37:24 GMT -6
A buddy and I have discussed crowd noise and participation for hours. I think winning would really help and without some sustained success in the Win column we will struggle. Below are some of our ideas that we have discussed over the years (some better than others) - I am sure on this forum we could come up with some great ideas: General ideas: 1. Have a regional HS marching band competition in the morning. The top two perform at halftime of the game. If we did this game after there are more seats installed on the upper level of the students side you could let all of the visiting bands set up where the students currently sit and push the students back behind them. If they all knew a few similar songs you could really make some noise. You would not only get hundreds of kids on USDs campus and at the game, most likely all of their parents would also buy tickets. 2. Theme nights- They have done a Halloween costume themed game in the past and the attendance was decent. You could do that or a variation every year. Do a Charlie - King of the Jungle night - students dress up as their favorite animals Throwback uniforms for the players was a good idea - we could have done a crowd throwback themed night. How about the team wears a vintage styled 1978 uniform to honor the championship team and have everyone in the crowd dress like the 70's. 70's music on the loudspeakers during pregame and breaks etc. ( I think you could actually get both the students and alumni involved in that. Could do a Coyotes at the Beach theme game - swim trunks , Hawaiian shirts optional for some, mandatory for fat guys like me...... I think students could really get behind that. 3. (Mentioned this one in a previous post) For the alumni section - start with 50-100 (depending on the demand) seats that are front and center that are designed to be the rowdy section. I think it could be an offshoot of Howling Pack and something that a group of people could really have fun with. Come up with a fun name, and make it our goal to get people excited and involved. My guess is people would get involved and respond. If you want to come and sit on your hands - there are plenty of seats (for now) they can sit and pretend they are at the library. We could keep track of how many offsides penalties the opposing team gets and make it our goal to get the other team to jump. The Dome could have a place where every time it happens it is recorded - kind of like strikeouts at a baseball game. I think that would be a blast and something everyone could get behind. I am really looking forward to thoughts from the group. We can't just keep complaining - we need to find some ways to try and do something. I wasn't complaining. Truthfully, I've given up on the students, and that's sad because the players respond well to them. However, saying that, I'll give a great big shoutout to the band. They are awesome, and have a lot of fun. And they're good. I like the idea of the "battle of the bands" with our band taking lead. But I would consider selling the students section tickets or hell, give them away to those that would love to go to games. Regarding my idea of creating a film on "how to make noise at appropriate tine" it's kind of said in jest, yet it's so damned silly maybe people would get the hint and make it work.
|
|
|
Post by GoYotes on Sept 22, 2014 20:03:11 GMT -6
Need to remember that the current students are the future ticket buyers and Howling Pack members.
|
|