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Post by gopheryote on Feb 20, 2017 17:45:16 GMT -6
I think mraugustana nailed it, and maybe didn't go far enough. USD is almost the same distance to Omaha than it is to Brookings. So, not surprisingly, many USD's fans are located in NW Iowa, NE Nebraska, as well as SE South Dakota. Almost no one in NW Iowa or NE Nebraska is picking up an Argus Leader.
SDSU has a very different reality - given where they are located, the geographic coverage is blanketed by the Argus for a long ways in every direction. They don't compete with someone like the SC Journal or Omaha World Herald in those areas until you get far enough away to consider Fargo & Minneapolis.
As such, it further lowers the potential Yotes fans readers compared to SDSU fans readers, and thus few clicks, etc.
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Post by gopheryote on Feb 20, 2017 17:46:37 GMT -6
Way to read just what you want to hear. I say that I don't bother with the Argus but have an opinion based on the times when it is brought up on this message board. I'll just pick out what I want from your post and leave with your confession that SDSU message board fans are sensitive and fickle. Damn. You just hate State, don't you? Actually I said he concluded that. Didn't confess anything. Try to keep up. Ummm, you completely missed his zinger, and then made it worse by telling him to keep up...
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Post by oldhare on Feb 20, 2017 18:01:06 GMT -6
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Post by canislatrans on Feb 20, 2017 19:54:09 GMT -6
Liked the article on Tyler Stoll, another nice job by Jeremy.
I have always enjoyed Mick's coverage, I don't quite understand the knock on him personally.
The Argus Leader, however, as it relates to college sports coverage (which is all I would read from them) is really puzzling. I can't believe it makes business sense, to not cover both D1 college sports with equal devotion. Two markets are better than one, you would think that would be a basic profit-driven approach. I'm not in the newspaper business (or digital media, more accurately), so I'm sure I'm missing the data about how sports fans are not the buying market, or something. But, if the answer to USD sports fans is that we need to read, click-on more Argus Leader articles, etc. to get more Coyote coverage, I think that is, as my father would say, 'a** backwards'. Who's selling the product, and who is buying? It's hard to get emotional about the dying newspaper business, if you can't figure out the basics.
That being said, I have and would encourage others to join the Coyote chats, and click on articles, it can't hurt. However, if the Argus Leader doesn't get it right, it's nice to know we have P&D and other choices.
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Post by Yotes on Feb 20, 2017 20:05:34 GMT -6
That was a fantastic piece by Jeremy. Definitely a story that few will know.
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Post by Yote 53 on Feb 21, 2017 10:00:45 GMT -6
You can also say, "Well they put themselves in this position because if they'd been covering USD more from the beginning, I'd probably be reading more of their articles." You nailed it there. The Argus cooked their own goose with their slanted coverage. You see, they are the business and we are the customers. If they are not selling what we want then we don't buy from them and get our product somewhere else. You say the Argus is struggling. Then how smart of it was them to turn off a significant portion of the available customer base in this state? If they want more business then they should try cultivating it by appealing to new customers. Slanted coverage isn't a new issue with the Argus, this issue goes back decades. Yes, they have pushed USD fans away for decades. Personally, I gave up on them around 1994. We have other options for our Coyote Athletics news, Midco, Yankton P&D, SC Journal, and, yes, even this site where pretty much everything Coyote related that comes out on social media is gathered and posted here. Frankly speaking, this site might just be the #1 source of information on Coyote Athletics that exists, and it is thanks to all of you that contribute. So what the Argus Leader does or doesn't do has no effect on me as I gave up reading that rag long ago.
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Post by jackfan86 on Feb 21, 2017 11:57:26 GMT -6
You can also say, "Well they put themselves in this position because if they'd been covering USD more from the beginning, I'd probably be reading more of their articles." You nailed it there. The Argus cooked their own goose with their slanted coverage. You see, they are the business and we are the customers. If they are not selling what we want then we don't buy from them and get our product somewhere else. You say the Argus is struggling. Then how smart of it was them to turn off a significant portion of the available customer base in this state? If they want more business then they should try cultivating it by appealing to new customers. Slanted coverage isn't a new issue with the Argus, this issue goes back decades. Yes, they have pushed USD fans away for decades. Personally, I gave up on them around 1994. We have other options for our Coyote Athletics news, Midco, Yankton P&D, SC Journal, and, yes, even this site where pretty much everything Coyote related that comes out on social media is gathered and posted here. Frankly speaking, this site might just be the #1 source of information on Coyote Athletics that exists, and it is thanks to all of you that contribute. So what the Argus Leader does or doesn't do has no effect on me as I gave up reading that rag long ago. This is probably closest to the best attitude to have for you guys if you're not a fan of the AL. I think Jeremy Hoeck does a hell of a job covering USD for the P&D. I'd say his coverage is every bit as good as Matt Zimmer's for SDSU at the AL. I do think Mick Garry could do a little more for USD, but perhaps he has other things on his plate. I wish there was as much SDSU involvement at the AL as there was when Terry Vandrovec was there. But there isn't, that's just how it is. They can't afford it and I get it. The paper industry is tough business in today's world. I don't think the AL intentionally ignores USD, they just do what the numbers tell them to do. And I don't think it's fair to blame it on Matt Zimmer when his job is literally the SDSU beat writer. He's not the USD beat writer, so naturally he won't be writing about them much. Again, I think you guys have a hell of a beat writer in Jeremy Hoeck. Follow his stuff if you don't like AL.
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Post by mraugustana on Feb 21, 2017 12:47:48 GMT -6
You nailed it there. The Argus cooked their own goose with their slanted coverage. You see, they are the business and we are the customers. If they are not selling what we want then we don't buy from them and get our product somewhere else. You say the Argus is struggling. Then how smart of it was them to turn off a significant portion of the available customer base in this state? If they want more business then they should try cultivating it by appealing to new customers. Slanted coverage isn't a new issue with the Argus, this issue goes back decades. Yes, they have pushed USD fans away for decades. Personally, I gave up on them around 1994. We have other options for our Coyote Athletics news, Midco, Yankton P&D, SC Journal, and, yes, even this site where pretty much everything Coyote related that comes out on social media is gathered and posted here. Frankly speaking, this site might just be the #1 source of information on Coyote Athletics that exists, and it is thanks to all of you that contribute. So what the Argus Leader does or doesn't do has no effect on me as I gave up reading that rag long ago. This is probably closest to the best attitude to have for you guys if you're not a fan of the AL. I think Jeremy Hoeck does a hell of a job covering USD for the P&D. I'd say his coverage is every bit as good as Matt Zimmer's for SDSU at the AL. I do think Mick Garry could do a little more for USD, but perhaps he has other things on his plate. I wish there was as much SDSU involvement at the AL as there was when Terry Vandrovec was there. But there isn't, that's just how it is. They can't afford it and I get it. The paper industry is tough business in today's world. I don't think the AL intentionally ignores USD, they just do what the numbers tell them to do. And I don't think it's fair to blame it on Matt Zimmer when his job is literally the SDSU beat writer. He's not the USD beat writer, so naturally he won't be writing about them much. Again, I think you guys have a hell of a beat writer in Jeremy Hoeck. Follow his stuff if you don't like AL. Oh, get out of here with that thoughtful, reasonable, well-worded response!
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Post by gopheryote on Feb 21, 2017 13:09:42 GMT -6
This is probably closest to the best attitude to have for you guys if you're not a fan of the AL. I think Jeremy Hoeck does a hell of a job covering USD for the P&D. I'd say his coverage is every bit as good as Matt Zimmer's for SDSU at the AL. I do think Mick Garry could do a little more for USD, but perhaps he has other things on his plate. I wish there was as much SDSU involvement at the AL as there was when Terry Vandrovec was there. But there isn't, that's just how it is. They can't afford it and I get it. The paper industry is tough business in today's world. I don't think the AL intentionally ignores USD, they just do what the numbers tell them to do. And I don't think it's fair to blame it on Matt Zimmer when his job is literally the SDSU beat writer. He's not the USD beat writer, so naturally he won't be writing about them much. Again, I think you guys have a hell of a beat writer in Jeremy Hoeck. Follow his stuff if you don't like AL. Agreed. Did someone blame any of this on Zimmer? If so, they should be called out - Zimmer writes for a different beat, and I think he does a good job on that beat, but he doesn't have anything to do with USD's coverage.
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Post by golfingyote on Feb 21, 2017 13:25:02 GMT -6
There is nothing in the letter about Zimmer, yet he is acting like its a personal attack on him. I like the guy and his stories, but seems like an overreaction to a letter thats not aimed at him and goes deeper than the 2-3 years hes been covering SDST.
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Post by jackfan86 on Feb 21, 2017 13:59:21 GMT -6
There is nothing in the letter about Zimmer, yet he is acting like its a personal attack on him. I like the guy and his stories, but seems like an overreaction to a letter thats not aimed at him and goes deeper than the 2-3 years hes been covering SDST. It doesn't necessarily get aimed at him. It mentions that they didn't like the headline involving Tellinghuisen. Which was the article Zimmer wrote from the SDSU perspective. It is directed at the paper he works for which may bother him. I'd get upset if people started disliking the company I work for because the company wasn't run how they thought it should be. I don't think there are a lot of people blaming Zimmer, but there are a few. A decent part of it is just a Twitter spat. I'm guessing he hears about it enough that it finally bothered him a little bit and let it show. I don't know. I'm just guessing.
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Post by coyotecrazie5 on Feb 21, 2017 14:32:42 GMT -6
I don't blame Zimmer for the headline and I don't believe the letter is about that either. It's no secret SDSU get more pub in the AL and that is fine. SDSU has more students, and a lot more alum who stay in SD. They are writing to their largest source of income which makes perfect business sense. It gets frustrating sometimes as a USD fan, but thats the way it is. AL could possibly cover the Yotes more to gain more subscribers, but will SDSU fans get mad and cancel theirs? That is the million dollar question.
Edit: SDSU has also started D1 first which got the more casual fans attention sooner and have had more overall success.
AL does an ok job at covering USD. The difference is Zimmer is a better writer than Mick and he writes with a homerish tone which is great if you are on that side, but sucks if you are on the other. Mick is tough for me to gauge personality wise. Zimmer seems like one of the boys and could grab a beer and BS with and have an enjoyable time. Mick just seems more guarded and somewhat awkward if you ever have seen him on tv. He writes the same way, without any emotion. He just writes the article and goes on to the next. That is fine, he is doing his job and what is asked of him. What also doesn't help him is that Hoeck straight up is the best writer in SD and I for one am glad he covers the Yotes.
CC5
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Post by Yote 53 on Feb 21, 2017 14:53:10 GMT -6
You can grab a beer with Mick, I have before, very nice guy. Mick's style isn't a raw-raw style, that's fine since he is a journalist and should be impartial.
You are all correct in that this has nothing to do with Zimmer and USD fan's issues with the AL go back, like I said, for decades. If the AL wants to expand their subscriber base than they might want to change how they cover USD a bit, give us a little more love, and they might just pull in another market. That's entirely up to them.
As it is, USD gets coverage from the P&D, SC Journal, and the AL. If you think about it, given all the publications covering USD, we actually get way more coverage than SDSU.
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Post by gopheryote on Feb 21, 2017 16:07:14 GMT -6
The infamous sports section currently in question: (ps - ignore the yellowish highlight, that was my screen doing something strange) Attachments:
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Post by yotebewithyou on Feb 21, 2017 19:09:41 GMT -6
The infamous sports section currently in question: (ps - ignore the yellowish highlight, that was my screen doing something strange) I'll admit, I thought the letter to the editor came off a little whiny, but after seeing that picture it kind of does look like they're slighting USD at the bottom. Just from a visual standpoint, wouldn't it make sense to put the winning team's article on the left? And the bold (SDSU) and un-bold (USD; is that a word?) headlines make the USD story look like more of a footnote. Again, I'm not saying they're blatantly setting out to de-legitimize USD, but little things like that add up in my opinion
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