dave
Sophomore Member
Posts: 112
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Post by dave on Sept 29, 2018 7:19:19 GMT -6
steelsd is probably right. But it seems likely that 'rivalry' is being re-defined as 'most important game from a championship POV'. It seems like a local rivalry seems to grow as you age (ex - working in the same office as alumni from other schools). Example: The street I live on is a mix of USD/SDSU/Minnesota alumni, all with flags out on Saturdays. Zero NDSU or UND fans, so zero bragging rights in daily life. NDSU is a big game for USD too - it will be sold out, tailgating will be intense, etc., but it wouldn't be if both teams were 2-6. Both State/U games (when UND comes in) will matter even if both teams playing are having lousy seasons. Question - does the xDSU game today even matter? Regardless of the outcome, aren't both all but guaranteed high playoff seeding based on current perceptions? Absolutely this game matters, home field in the playoffs is dependant upon the outcome of this game. The road to Frisco goes through Fargo, it's nearly impossible to win up there in the playoffs. You're only hope is to land a top four seed and be on the opposite side of the bracket of the Bison, or better yet beat the Bison and hope someone else in the Valley can tag them with a loss or two and hope they will finally have to play on the road. I've watched too many Jackrabbit seasons end on the Fargo Dome turf.
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Post by aldewitt on Sept 29, 2018 7:19:34 GMT -6
UND lives for the rivalry with NDSU. They have nothing else, little history, little tradition, just scattered short periods of success. They thought they had deliverd the death blow to NDSU when they held the press conference and quit the series. What actually happened is UND faded into obscruity and NDSU rose to the top of the FCS football world. NDSUs stadium filled up. UNDs emptied.
The only game that would fill the UND arena with actual people and not invisible season ticket holders would be NDSU. They quit playing NDSU because they said the scholarship difference was too great and it would no longer be fair to them. It's the recruiting difference now and it's still no longer fair to them.
They did move up on the last day. After the confusion cleared they found themselves in the Fabulous Fargo once more. They lost 34-9. They did get a first down in the fourth quarter though. They don't do well in domes, it seems, losing here last year 45-7.
Next time UND comes to Fargo it will be packed. Most games are. UND fans will be buying tickets for $200-$300. It won't be any kind of atmosphere like the Marker brings. I've been to both stadiums for the games. It's huge, it's fun and I assure you both schools want to win.
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Post by aldewitt on Sept 29, 2018 7:34:59 GMT -6
I propose we follow the Utah model of one collective battle for a trophy: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beehive_BootAll 4 schools play each other, the one with the best record gets the trophy. I don't care what that trophy is. It would be good bragging rights for the winner. Great idea. In fact, it's the basis of the Dakota Big Three: NDSU, SDSU and USD Their round robin football competition is a defacto Dakota College Football Championship. I have awarded the mythical Dakota College Football trophy every year. It can end in a tie but most years it is won outright. Today is the first round with SDSU @ NDSU. At one time they were the only 2 D1 participants in the series. When UND is on the regular schedules they will be included, but right now they dont play the entire field. It would be great to see it get official. I think it would be huge, but like it or not, The Dakota College Football Championship Series begins today.
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 656
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Post by jackjd on Sept 29, 2018 7:46:58 GMT -6
I think aldewitt’s comments are accurate. Some posters seem irked by what they declare is a contrived rivalry between NDSU and SDSU. No matter how the Marker trophy was created, the game certainly is no longer just another game.. I’ve been to most of the Marker games: all of them at SDSU and several of them at NDSU. I’ll be watching today’s Marker battle on TV. They are tremendous events. The numbers bear out what aldewitt says. In my view, no other MVFC game comes close to the atmosphere at a Marker Game. FCS football fans know what the Marker game means. FBS fans in the regional are aware of the game. I have ESPN Gameday on...they refer to the Marker Game.
It’s possible the USD V SDSU game will grow in importance but right now it doesn’t compare. Currently, neither USD or SDSU fan base will travel in strong numbers to the other’s stadium. For me that is due in large part to the lack of seating at the DakotaDome (credit to the USD fans for filling the place up). The USD fans won’t travel to SDSU like the NDSU fans. As SDSU’s fans continue to show in greater numbers, the NDSU fans are starting to gripe about availability of seats.
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Post by kiyoat on Sept 29, 2018 7:54:57 GMT -6
I wonder how many of us old SNL fans got that reference without having to google it. 😅 It was actually a different Gilda Radner character, though. “Emily Litella”. (I did have to google that one)
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Post by Yote 53 on Sept 29, 2018 7:58:19 GMT -6
Yet on the eve of the biggest rivalry game of the year for the Jacks, SDSU fans are showing up on a USD message board. You guys make my case for me.
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 656
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Post by jackjd on Sept 29, 2018 8:35:00 GMT -6
Yet on the eve of the biggest rivalry game of the year for the Jacks, SDSU fans are showing up on a USD message board. You guys make my case for me. Wrong conclusion. Yesterday I visited this board to see what USD fans were saying about SIU. I entered a post and later replaced it (not sure if one can delete a post on this board) with “Never mind.” (Which prompted the funny SNL reference — I remember well Gilda Radner doing her never mind’ Emily Letilla routine). I also took a look at several other MVFC message boards as well as the message boards for OOC schools UND, Montana and Montana State. Added: Yote53, I have degrees from both SDSU and USD (like I think most people, my roots were planted where I got my undergrad degree and participated in sports, so I’m a Jackrabbit). I like college football. While at SDSU, I didn’t miss a home game in four years and I traveled to the close away games including one at Inman Field. While at USD, I’m pretty sure I missed just one game in three years. (Some of the best seasons at USD— I watched Yoteforever’s championship team). Yote 53: if this board’s software is similar to other message board software, you may, as administrator, be able to see my post as originally made but then replaced with Never mind. You will see I commented that I was visiting the board to see what was being discussed about the SIU game but discovered, and posted, that there was more discussion about SDSU and NDSU and the Dakota Marker. After a couple of minutes I decided to erase my message and since the board software required me to write something, I wrote Never Mind. My original post could have been read to be a poke and I decided that was not appropriate.—couldn’t delete it so I replaced it. This morning, I am watching ESPN’s College GameDay as I do most Saturday mornings. With one eye on the TV, I visit several fan message boards from the MVFC which today included this board. I think the SIU and USD game could be a good one. SIU shows signs of improvement and while I think USD wins, a resurgent SIU program at home will make it a good game and USD may be challenged. Again I see there is more discussion on the Marker Game, a topic that seems to particularly bother you, Yote 53. I added a couple of comments. I will continue to read news of other conference games and to check out message boards on game day. I can easily separate the USD football program under Coach Nielsen from fans like you, Yote 53. Good luck to the Yotes at SIU. But for you, Yote53, well, have a nice day renting space in your head to the Jackrabbits. 😁
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Post by coyote70 on Sept 29, 2018 9:10:20 GMT -6
Since it is so early in the season, I view the Dakota Marker game as a "Reputation Game" as much as anything. Imagine if the Coyote's game against KSU had been cancelled at the end of the third quarter and we had played Arkansas Pine Bluff at home instead of Weber State on the road.
Yes, we didn't play very well at Weber but our strength of schedule to date (#1 in the FCS) makes me wonder how things stack up if SDSU loses big and the Coyotes win this weekend. We'll see I guess.
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Post by aldewitt on Sept 29, 2018 10:05:03 GMT -6
Just talked to a friend headed in to the Marker Game and he says it is a madhouse.
They are expecting a big win in Fargo.
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Post by yoteforever on Sept 29, 2018 10:33:33 GMT -6
I’m sick of debating about rivalries. We didn’t go D1 when we should’ve and we’re still paying for it in terms of trying to define who our rival is. Naturally USD/SDSU is a rival by logistics but not what it was 15 years ago. SDSU does have a rivalry with the Bison due to timing plus both teams having success at this level. When we elevate our program to the point we are in year end discussions on conference titles or playoff implications then we will have “rivalries” with those teams that we can eliminate or them eliminate us. The answer to all this non productive discussion is JUST WIN.
Someone commented that USD fans don’t travel en masse like NDSU, and that person is right. Hell, we have a difficult time selling out a smaller capacity DakotaDome. Our fan base has to change and jump in enthusiastically starting yesterday. I think it’s possible but not sure it will because quite frankly we are lethargic. If we make the Dome miserable for opponents to come to, then and only then will be in discussions every week. Most teams in the MVFC have talent, NDSU probably more than others, but anyone in the top 6-7 teams can beat anyone. That goes for USD as well. Confidence and believing will do that.
This fan base needs to believe and get ramped up. I still think 6-2 in this league is possible. But we need to change our mindset...both team and fans alike....now. I 100% believe in this staff and their ability to lead us. But they need help...and that means all of us spreading the word to get the Dome rocking. It starts with a win tonight. This is a decent ( not great ) SIU team. We need to win to make a statement. Win convincingly. Get behind this team and quit worrying about everyone else. One game at a time.
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Post by yoteforever on Sept 29, 2018 10:35:51 GMT -6
Just talked to a friend headed in to the Marker Game and he says it is a madhouse. They are expecting a big win in Fargo. No disrespect but I don’t care.
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Post by Yotes on Sept 29, 2018 12:00:14 GMT -6
I am also over debating about rivalries. It's pretty simple, xDSU's have a rivalry stemming from moving up together and having their most important game of the regular season against each other for about 15 years now. Think of Nebraska-Oklahoma. Each football game against each other is big, but also dependent on both participants being top teams for an extended period of times. It doesn't transcend all sports, and if either team fell from grace the interest in this game would rapidly decline. It's not at all a contrived rivalry, but also may not be built to last.
State-U is the real natural rivalry. The hate between schools is built into the population within each state. UND and NDSU haven't regularly played each other in many years. I still constantly see UND fans deriding NDSU, and matching that we get to see Aldewitt rag on UND unprovoked in about half of his posts here. High competition would magnify the intensity, but it's intense on its own without even having a competition to talk about.
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Post by Yotes on Sept 29, 2018 12:08:43 GMT -6
Anyways, today's Marker game is another big one because a win by either side could set the tone for the MVFC season. Illinois State (and the homer in me wants to include USD) would be the only variable. I'm expecting NDSU to completely expose sdsu though. They haven't really had to play any meaningful football yet this year and I'm thinking they've been able to hide behind reputation from past years (I suppose you could say the same about NDSU but that place is a championship factory).
Missouri State's demolition of NAU has been really interested to see how they fare against Illinois State. Both teams are looking much tougher than I expected this year.
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Post by Yote 53 on Sept 29, 2018 13:15:52 GMT -6
Renting space in my head? You are the one compelled to come here to write a book. Again, you make my case for me.
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Post by gopheryote on Sept 29, 2018 14:35:58 GMT -6
MSU 10 ISUr 0 @ halftime What is going on here?
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