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Post by yoteforever on Jan 18, 2018 7:24:09 GMT -6
This thread has been created for those obsessed with "reported numbers" to athletic events at USD and any other school to which we are having a supposed race with. Any pictures of empty or filled seats are welcome. Pictures of lines at concession stands welcome. Lines for the bathroom. Photos of people in CorTrust room welcome. Basically any evidence to support whatever point you want to make is welcome.
Please use this devoted thread to support your argument why or why not "official" attendance numbers are accurate or not.
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Post by elcoyote on Jan 18, 2018 7:46:11 GMT -6
This thread has been created for those obsessed with "reported numbers" to athletic events at USD and any other school to which we are having a supposed race with. Any pictures of empty or filled seats are welcome. Pictures of lines at concession stands welcome. Lines for the bathroom. Photos of people in CorTrust room welcome. Basically any evidence to support whatever point you want to make is welcome. Please use this devoted thread to support your argument why or why not "official" attendance numbers are accurate or not. How about pictures of people in the bathroom?
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Post by yoteforever on Jan 18, 2018 7:47:13 GMT -6
This thread has been created for those obsessed with "reported numbers" to athletic events at USD and any other school to which we are having a supposed race with. Any pictures of empty or filled seats are welcome. Pictures of lines at concession stands welcome. Lines for the bathroom. Photos of people in CorTrust room welcome. Basically any evidence to support whatever point you want to make is welcome. Please use this devoted thread to support your argument why or why not "official" attendance numbers are accurate or not. How about pictures of people in the bathroom? I would like any and all evidence. So yes. Let it all hang out In order to keep it from tanking, any photo of those in stalls a picture of feet only is suffice
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Post by gopheryote on Jan 18, 2018 7:55:04 GMT -6
Can you move my post from last night over here? I actually looked for a thread like this and couldn't find one.
PS - although not my thing, some people do give a crap, that's why it is posted in the paper/stats. One man's attendance is another man's recruiting conversation for 2020 teams...
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Post by kiyoat on Jan 18, 2018 8:09:28 GMT -6
Can you move my post from last night over here? I actually looked for a thread like this and couldn't find one. PS - although not my thing, some people do give a crap, that's why it is posted in the paper/stats. One man's attendance is another man's recruiting conversation for 2020 teams... Yeah, I agree. I do give a crap, too. I think its a good stat to look at, and can indicate a growing or waning fan interest. Obviously money and reputation are on the line for the Athletic Department, too. On the other hand, the b!@hing and arguing about the accuracy of those numbers ad nauseum has been an unnecessary distraction, and a cancer on this board IMO. This is a good alternative to censorship IMHO.
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Post by yoteforever on Jan 18, 2018 8:23:57 GMT -6
You're 100% correct...it is relevant. But given the pettiness and turn the discussion was taking I created the thread to accommodate that sector of posters in jest. Really nothing more than that.
I just find it hard to believe the biggest complainer of our attendance numbers and the constant comparison to South Dakota State College of Agriculture and Mechanis Arts who in the past has acknowledged he won't buy season tickets if the teams aren't formidable keeps up his constant barrage of attacking this topic. EVERYONE knows attendance numbers reported aren't the same as butts in seat. I mean EVERYONE. So why keep on harping on it?
If someone wants to debate/have a discussion on the business side of this topic by all means let's debate it the appropriate thread. But if all we are going to do is bash Herbster or Williams for reporting "funky" numbers, then this is the thread.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Jan 19, 2018 1:46:29 GMT -6
I want to re post this for a reference to what I counted for the dome capacity for football. The U cannot be posting their attendance numbers in football based on tickets sold because it is impossible to sell more tickets than the capacity of the stadium. Yotes counted himself and also came up with a capacity under the average attendance.
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I have always wanted to do this and I wanted to take the time to post what I found out. I used the actual ticket purchasing area on the website and counted the number the seats in section G and A which equal 784 and 222 respectively and I counted the potential wheelchair spots in that as well so I did not short change this.
I looked at all section and sections B,C,D,F,G,H all seem to be the same size. There may be a few more seats available in sections B and H because of the bleacher seats in the upper half of each of those sections but it wouldn't be a big difference.
So here is the tabulation by section for the grand stand
A = 222 B = 830 (adding 46 seats for bleachers but this is an estimate) C = 784 D = 784 E = 600 (estimated because of it being a slightly smaller section) F = 784 G = 784 H = 830 (adding 46 seats for beachers but this is an estimate) I = 222 (which look identical to section A)
Entire Grand Stand = 5840 - If you want to add 100 seats for the patio deck near section I that would be 5940 so that would probably be the max capacity of the grand stand.
By looking at the photos of the dome I would guess at most the west bleachers would hold 1500.
So by my estimate that makes the dome capacity for football at 7440 which is pretty much right on for what I thought it might be.
What this does is legitimize the WNIT final game attendance which I believe was announced at 7400 plus change. That attendance announcement was probably pretty much right on. Unfortunately for football most of the crowds are actually close to 6,500-7,000 then they are the 9,500 that is being announced with a near capacity crowd.
So for actual seating capacity to be expanded to 15,000 for football the west side grand stand would have to be able to hold at least 9,000 considering that you would no longer have the west side bleachers. I don't think it would be possible to get to that type of number. When you consider actual attendance at Coyote football games which is generally about 7,000 when it is full that dome probably does not need to expand to anything near 15,000 seats. I would say a legitimate expansion to 12,000 is probably more realistic and would allow for about a 40% increase in attendance. I am not sure of the current rules but to go to FBS some day if it requires a 15K sized stadium I am not sure if that would even be possible in the current dome.
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Post by Yote 53 on Jan 19, 2018 12:04:43 GMT -6
Never mind that they scan the actual tickets to the damn game. Every time you here a *beep* that is a ticket being counted. Pretty easy to track electronically, don't ya think? Computers can also track tickets sold with those that go used/unused. Probably add the number of bodies in the building with the number of tickets sold but unused and, voila, there is your attendance figure.
I'll take the computers over your counting and estimating the number of fannies the bleachers hold.
Finally, this is it. Derail other threads with constant debate about attendance and you'll get put in timeout. Keep it where it belongs. You have all been warned.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Jan 19, 2018 12:57:32 GMT -6
I guess the dome has a secret compartment that people watch the game from that isn't listed when selling tickets online. There are about 2,000 people that watch the game from there and apparently very few people know where that area is located. Just look at the announced attendance for the WNIT final and that is what your typical football crowd is. There were at least as many people at that game than at the normal football game.
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Post by yote14 on Jan 19, 2018 14:55:07 GMT -6
It's pretty tough to deny the numbers the electronic system that counts each ticket gets.
For the WNIT game the outside sections and the howling pack loft was not used if I remember correctly.
I really don't care one way or the other but I find it very unlikely that for the last 40 years when the dome sells out they would lie about it every time as just over 10k?
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Post by Coyote Fan on Jan 19, 2018 15:04:49 GMT -6
well rationalize away but the main grandstand holds less than 6000 and I counted the seats so I don't know how much more evidence is needed. If people would just admit that the capacity for a football game is much closer to 7500 than to 10K than there wouldn't be a reason to continue this discussion. if the West side bleachers were jam packed they might hold 2K and that is a stretch. this season the average attendance was around 7K. Cry and whine away but it is what it is.
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Post by yotebewithyou on Jan 19, 2018 15:43:28 GMT -6
I'd guess that there are around 8000-8500 seats in the dome. Pretty sure 2k can fit on the west side.
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Post by gopheryote on Jan 19, 2018 15:45:28 GMT -6
well rationalize away but the main grandstand holds less than 6000 and I counted the seats so I don't know how much more evidence is needed. If people would just admit that the capacity for a football game is much closer to 7500 than to 10K than there wouldn't be a reason to continue this discussion. if the West side bleachers were jam packed they might hold 2K and that is a stretch. this season the average attendance was around 7K. Cry and whine away but it is what it is. Actually, the conversation stems from a relative comparison (SDSU playoff vs. USD regular season). A very reasonable conclusion would be that if C.F. would admit that all teams exaggerate (based on their own metrics), and this isn't USD trying to mislead everyone, the conversation would be over.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Jan 19, 2018 16:55:15 GMT -6
I'd guess that there are around 8000-8500 seats in the dome. Pretty sure 2k can fit on the west side. That's just it, a guess. I actually counted and there are fewer than 6,000 seats on the east grand stand that are "for sale" seats. I probably slightly over exaggerated when I estimated what I did in my earlier count. The capacity on the west side is fewer than 2,000 as it is now. When the wooden bleachers were over there it may have been more. When they number those bleachers on the west side there is not exactly much room as people would be packed in their pretty tight. I would have to look but the 1600 figure seems to ring a bell with the capacity over their and that does include where the band sits. I am not sure if the band is supposed to count in the overall attendance numbers but that is part of the capacity on that end. 7500 would be a very good estimation of the capacity for football and that would include a plum full Dakota Dome with much room to squeeze anymore in. Honestly to get to 10,000 fans, roughly 2500 people would have to stand around the end zones. I am not doing this as a purposeful slap at USD but I just don't like it when people over exaggerate although it happens quite often in life. That is the same reason why I do not like the doubling (or more) of the basketball attendance numbers that USD puts out.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Jan 19, 2018 17:07:20 GMT -6
well rationalize away but the main grandstand holds less than 6000 and I counted the seats so I don't know how much more evidence is needed. If people would just admit that the capacity for a football game is much closer to 7500 than to 10K than there wouldn't be a reason to continue this discussion. if the West side bleachers were jam packed they might hold 2K and that is a stretch. this season the average attendance was around 7K. Cry and whine away but it is what it is. Actually, the conversation stems from a relative comparison (SDSU playoff vs. USD regular season). A very reasonable conclusion would be that if C.F. would admit that all teams exaggerate (based on their own metrics), and this isn't USD trying to mislead everyone, the conversation would be over. I would have no problem if USD would report attendance accurately if they described it accurately. If they want to report paid attendance than post "paid attendance" on the box score. Why not have a paid attendance and an actual attendance. Why hide the truth. It's like in football people don't recognize that the defense is a weakness and that the 4th quarter performance is a weakness. If those issues continue to be ignored nothing will be done to correct it. If USD is going to announce 2K in attendance when 800 might be a closer estimation than their will never be anything done to correct it because it is kind of assumed to be acceptable. Maybe when I paid my tuition I should have given them a stack of cash and told them that this is my paid tuition. The actual money in the stack may have been half of what I owed but as long as I report it as correct, than it should be acceptable, isn't that right. When I walk away they may come after me and say "hey their is only 800 dollars here and you owe a total of 2000.00. You say there is 2000 fans at the game and I say there is only 800 and I was the one that actually counted. That is why I took the time to count the actual dots on the website when you go in to purchase a ticket for football. If a kid came home with a report card and it said F but the kid convinced a parent because of how hard they tried they really should get a C instead. They can just tell their parents to consider their grade a C. Do ya think the parents are buying it? We are in a world now that presidents and politicians can tell flat out lies and people will give them a pass because they might be affiliated with the same party as the person lying. They say it is fake news and blame the media which is basically the same thing as telling people "we know we are lying but we ask that you just ignore it and move on".
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