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Post by kiyoat on Feb 24, 2018 13:41:50 GMT -6
Meh. We get that for a women's game on a Wednesday night... #worstfansever? #lookedemptytome #almosthalfthecrowdwaswearingred Both USD/SDSU games drew more at the SCSC than Frost. Men: 5K vs 4K (This was a legit 5K, even Coyote Fan agreed) Women: 4K vs 3500 (also a legit full house)
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Post by Yotes on Feb 24, 2018 16:41:03 GMT -6
Meh. We get that for a women's game on a Wednesday night... #worstfansever? #lookedemptytome #almosthalfthecrowdwaswearingred Both USD/SDSU games drew more at the SCSC than Frost. Men: 5K vs 4K (This was a legit 5K, even Coyote Fan agreed) Women: 4K vs 3500 (also a legit full house) That's because their real rival is NDSU.
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Post by kiyoat on Feb 24, 2018 17:59:31 GMT -6
While we're on the subject, both the men and women averaged about 100 more per game than their Rabbit counterparts. Could we be seeing some casual fans switching sides?......hmm.
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Post by elcoyote on Feb 24, 2018 18:39:25 GMT -6
While we're on the subject, both the men and women averaged about 100 more per game than their Rabbit counterparts. Could we be seeing some casual fans switching sides?......hmm. Oh, the horrors at even suggesting such blasphemy!
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Post by Coyote Fan on Feb 26, 2018 17:29:31 GMT -6
www.goyotes.com/galleries/?gallery=247I think this is an appropriate topic (and most certainly the appropriate thread) right now since some of the recent discussion has been about the attendance and comparing USD's attendance vs other Summit schools. Lets take a look at a prime example of over inflating numbers. Many of the other schools probably do it as well such as ORU or Omaha but I would have to say that SDSU as much as I dislike them is probably fairly honest with their announced attendance. I have some Florida land I would like to sell for those that actually believe that butts in the seats on average are more at USD than SDSU. I know this is a Women's game but the link to the photo gallery above shows multiple shots of the entire arena or the majority of it and it is while the game action is going on so very few people would not be in their seats. Every game in the schedule area has a photo gallery next to the box score so it is easy to tell how accurately USD is announcing their attendance. The average attendance for Men's basketball is being reported at 2335 per game. The game in the photo gallery (and I am using this game as only an example) is against UC Riverside for the Women. The announced attendance is 1611. Look for yourself. This crowd is about 300. 500 would be a major stretch but if someone told me they estimated this crowd at under 200 I could not definitively say they were not correct. USD is over estimating their attendance by about 5 times over for this game. When USD reports an average attendance of 2335 per game the actual average is probably half of that and maybe not even that. I was actually happy with the progress that attendance made towards the end of the year. There was a nice crowd there for the double header against ORU/Omaha. I just simply believe in facts and the facts are that the attendance is over blown by quite a bit. I actually don't have as big of a problem with the attendance being over inflated as I do with people that don't believe that USD is inflating it.
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Post by kiyoat on Feb 26, 2018 17:56:57 GMT -6
www.goyotes.com/galleries/?gallery=247I think this is an appropriate topic (and most certainly the appropriate thread) right now since some of the recent discussion has been about the attendance and comparing USD's attendance vs other Summit schools. Lets take a look at a prime example of over inflating numbers. Many of the other schools probably do it as well such as ORU or Omaha but I would have to say that SDSU as much as I dislike them is probably fairly honest with their announced attendance. I have some Florida land I would like to sell for those that actually believe that butts in the seats on average are more at USD than SDSU. here is the problem with your thinking. You are under the assumption that USD literally lies about their attendance. I think it's pretty obvious to people that have season tickets and regularly attend games (not you, BTW) that there is a fairly large number of people that buy season tickets, and simply don't go to a lot of the games. Especially weeknight games. As a guess to why, maybe the alumni association has been good at marketing those tickets to out-of-town alumni. Who knows? If that is the major discrepancy (and I think it is), then it might be nice if people were encouraged to move down into those seats, when there are no-shows. The point is that counting SOLD tickets rather than just the gate is not being dishonest. It's basically what EVERY school does, including SDSU. Do you think Nebraska's record decades-long sellout streak has come without some empty seats that were bought up at the last minute by boosters or sponsors? That stuff happens everywhere, and USD's case is nowhere near as bad as ORU or UNO. The other issue is that Frost Arena happens to be really good at looking full, even with only 1500 or 2000 fans, because of the small number of permanent seats, and the retractable bleachers that force the fans closer to the action. GopherYote explained that earlier in this thread, and Mike Zimmer basically just said the EXACT same thing in a recent radio interview that I transcribed in another thread. You can continue to be blind on this issue if you want, but I'm not giving you an ounce of credence until you buy season tickets to at least the women's team next year. You are out of excuses.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Feb 26, 2018 18:31:19 GMT -6
In general the common person when looking at attendance numbers is going to assume that the attendance is based on butts in the seats so when attendance is over inflated it is a misrepresentation to the common person. Since the word "attend" is in the word attendance I would think actually being at the game would be a requirement. Just because a lot other schools do the same thing does not make it any less of a misrepresentation. The reason I started this topic back up was because of the message that referenced Oral Roberts and showed a video of their attendance so that is more of a notion of actual attendance and not paid tickets bought (which I don't consider attendance). Whether I buy season tickets has nothing to do with this argument what-so-ever so I don't know why you would even bring that up. There are way too many undesirable games and week night games to make season tickets make sense for an out of towner. That is beyond the point and for a different discussion though.
You can call it anything you want to call it but USD does not report accurately the number of fans that attend a game and that is not debatable. Sold tickets in itself does not help the game day atmosphere. Fans that walk through the turnstiles is what helps game day atmosphere. I have given plenty of my money to the University so I don't think I need defend anything on that front.
Kiyoat don't make this about the poster but make it about the topic. That is what the admin wanted when there was a poll put up for my potential banning. You are making this about the poster.
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Post by yotefan90 on Feb 26, 2018 19:00:49 GMT -6
It's crazy how this just keeps getting dredged up over and over again. I think it has clearly been stated that USD counts tickets sold, not butts in the seats. I am at nearly every game and agree with it as well. USD is not alone in doing this as the examples of other universities, large and small, do the exact same thing (Husker football example). And it doesn't end there as I have seen countless NFL, MLB and NBA games announced as sellouts but yet have thousands of empty seats.
SDSU happens to be a school that only announces butts in the seats. I believe the amount of schools that do this is smaller than the number that announce sold tickets but that is purely a guess on my count. I will say that State announced their football game this year with NDSU was sold out. However, announced attendance for that game was in the 18k range for a stadium that holds nearly 20k. It is what it is and both methods are accepted. There is no cheating going on.
Accept it for what it is, this horse doesn't need any more beatings.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Feb 26, 2018 22:55:46 GMT -6
This thread was created for the reason to talk about this subject. Since average Summit attendance just came out and it was discussed in this thread it is an appropriate time to talk about it in an appropriate thread. If you go to a thread that is for attendance and that is being talked about don't be surprised.
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Post by gopheryote on Feb 27, 2018 6:19:00 GMT -6
This thread was created for the reason to talk about this subject. Since average Summit attendance just came out and it was discussed in this thread it is an appropriate time to talk about it in an appropriate thread. If you go to a thread that is for attendance and that is being talked about don't be surprised. Pretty sure yotefan90 wasn't referring to how attendance keeps getting brought up, but that the conversation seems to always consist of re-taking the same ground over and over. There are several ways to determine the official attendance, and those who work in the sports industry have developed accepted methods that are industry norms. USD has their way, MN Vikings have their way, and SDSU has their way - almost no one at this level just makes up a number that sounds good. No reason to keep saying one of them is doing it wrong, when that really means "not MY way". Seems like it would be more fun to discuss trends (good or bad) and what those trends mean to the program, and as long as everyone is somewhat consistent (everyone but ORU from a few years ago would be), then analysis is OK even if you don't like someone's method.
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Post by kiyoat on Feb 27, 2018 13:32:05 GMT -6
Coyotes Fan, wouldn't it be more accurate to say that your main complaint seems to be that your definition of "attendance" doesn't match the NCAA's definition of the same?
USD is following the NCAA's definition in thier reporting. Whether you agree with that definition or not should not be directed solely at USD, unless there is another reason for your vendetta?
Maybe a few sessions with a psychiatrist could uncover the true source for your butthurt?
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Post by Yote 53 on Feb 27, 2018 15:32:22 GMT -6
Let's keep it civil in here.
The only reason this thread exists and has not been locked down is so that this attendance drivel is confined to one place. If you have to debate it, keep it civil, if you just can't or just can't stand the subject, stay out of the thread.
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Post by gopheryote on Feb 27, 2018 16:01:19 GMT -6
Wondering if any of our rabbit fan friends can chime in on why MBB has gone down 4 years in a row now? That's not a good trend. Was it the lull after the first runs, style of play, etc.? Not sure how much ticket revenue makes up their MBB budget...
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dave
Sophomore Member
Posts: 112
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Post by dave on Feb 27, 2018 16:26:09 GMT -6
IMHO Frost is in desperate need of a remodel, every time they have tried to improve seating the past few years they have made the site lines a little worse,concession and restroom lines are plenty long also. I have chosen to stay home and watch the webcast, keep in mind it is nearly a three hour drive to Brookings for me, if I was within an hour I would buy season tickets. Ticket prices are a concern, doesn't affect me I'll pay what they are asking, other people I know complain a little, it is a pretty big expense for young people with families. I have been watching SDSU athletics since the mid 80's, and attending the State U games in Vermillion since about 1990 it seams like there are less people attending sporting events in general, what's the cause IDK, too many other entertainment options, is it easier to stay home and watch the webcast?
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Post by Yote 53 on Feb 27, 2018 16:39:47 GMT -6
It's interesting, where are the crowds? What are people doing with their time these days? Attendance at college athletics in all sports is trending downward. Pro sports are also seeing the same downward pressure. At the same time TV ratings are falling. Look at the numbers of the recently completed Olympics. Read an article where it was the lowest viewership for an Olympics ever. Thing is, relative to the other networks, viewership completely blew them out of the water by a ton. Takeaway, the Olympics still delivered the largest percentage of eyeballs actually watching TV, just not as many people watching TV.
Are that many people streaming now and we have a nation of Netflix addicts? Or gaming? It's not like the local parks and libraries are full and people are involved in civic activities in droves. What they heck are people doing with their time?
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