|
Post by Coyote Fan on Dec 13, 2012 17:38:32 GMT -6
David Sayler was worth his salary and more to USD but he got away. Same with Ryun Williams and to a lesser degree Joel Nielson as he was a much better AD than what was previously on board.
Arguably USD's top two assets in Sayler and Williams bolted. One can argue all they want as far as the reasoning the the fact still remains good people are leaving USD.
I really don't think the contract length was a decision for either but maybe I am wrong.
Why does it seem like USD is having these problems more than other like schools.
What is going on at USD that people are leaving. It's not just my opinion but the guys on KWSN sportstalk said the same thing. I believe I also heard it on ESPN radio 99.1 in Sioux Falls.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 21:09:43 GMT -6
Yeah go from an FCS school to an fbs school for both. In sayler's case, Ohio is home and did a lot for usd in 2 years and has left it I better shape. Moving up to a Mac school is a big promotion just like it was for Nielsen.
In terms of Williams, another great promotion to a league that is better than the summit and a school with more resources and recruiting base than usd and SDSU combined.
Not exactly rocket science, when a great opportunity comes along, usually you take it and they did and there isn't a reason to blame them. Maybe you should look at it that usd has made some great hires with to a of potential with them moving up. These aren't lateral moves. These are going a few stories up to the new corporate level.
|
|
|
Post by Coyote Fan on Dec 13, 2012 22:19:20 GMT -6
Other schools have made great hires but those coaches don't leave at the rate people are leaving USD. AJ up at State is a good example. He had a better opportunity at Wisconsin Green Bay took it but decided that what he had at SDSU was just too good to leave. If AJ was an opportunity for Colorado State I am sure he would have gotten the job over Ryun.
Like I said people are leaving USD for better opportunities. Why is it that USD isn't a good place to stay? Colorado State is decent but it's not like a major program. Kent State and Miami are certainly not major programs.
If USD was a place where people wanted to be than they wouldn't leave it at the first chance or what certainly seems to be.
Maybe I am the only one starting to see a bit of a trend.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 22:31:39 GMT -6
Kent state and Miami are much better opportunities than any school in South Dakota lol. Was Wisconsin-green bay a better opportunity? Slightly but not by much. These were big promotions for all three and can't blame any of them for taking it.
Fbs compared to FCS is usually a pretty good jump up, no doubt. Compare it to your career, if this opportunity came along, what would you say, especially if it is a major benefit for your family? Would you say no? Sounds like it.
|
|
|
Post by Coyote Fan on Dec 13, 2012 22:43:13 GMT -6
CF#1 what you are saying is correct I do not deny you that but that doesn't change the fact that some of the better and more promising people are still leaving USD. Even Lavin and Koupal both went with Williams, what does that say. They all basically jumped ship. All apparently very loyal and dedicated Coyote coaches, all gone. They chose to leave USD. SDSU does not have these troubles. They have a 2 time playoff head coach in football that wasn't or isn't looking for other opportunities. A.J. hasn't appeared to be looking. Craig Bohl at NDSU isn't leaving or hasn't left.
This is like the ultimate slap, when USD does get good people they leave. Otherwise mediocre coaches are always in place that don't want to leave. Even Ed who got fired couldn't even get a good job outside USD. He probably would have stayed for awhile, that is until he had success and than would have probably bolted as well.
This isn't just me saying this. I heard it on two sports talk shows today. It's not like this is just me thinking this.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 22:54:59 GMT -6
First off, Craig mattick's show is just awful lol. Second, just cause the SDSU coaches have left then usd's should? Didn't Salem and debour both leave their programs, where is their loyalty? So people are staying in brookings,good for then, but the Gary oatterson's and Shaka smart's of the world are much more rare than the rest.
Why did koupal and Lavin leave? Maybe Lavin missed it and didn't want to be the head coach and Colorado state can pay assistants really well and the csu campus and town is awesome.
There are many reasons, but I don't think there is a turnover problem when much better schools offer you a good contract. South Dakota and even SDSU will never be at the levels as a csu or Miami, plain and simple.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 22:57:14 GMT -6
Oh, and Sayler will no longer have to get emails from you on how to do his job.
|
|
|
Post by Coyote Fan on Dec 13, 2012 22:59:17 GMT -6
For me the red flag is Ryun Williams taking Lavin and Koupal with him. That is at least a little disturbing in my eyes. Ryun Williams was at his alma mater my gosh I would call that an awfully good situation. If I could coach at my alma mater it's gonna take better than Colorado State to pry me away. Apparently for Williams it didn't take much. Same can be said for the AD's who didn't take that much better of a situation than what they had at USD. It's not like these people were going to UCLA, Tennessee and Ohio State. These are still mid major type schools.
Another question I ask as well. Were these coached approached by these schools that hired them or were they actively looking? That is a rather large question.
Generally when people have jobs that they like they need a fairly significant upgrade to make a change for their security, financial well being and desirability. People generally look around for other jobs when they don't like the situation they are in. Not always, just more often than not. If people like their job they would probably be willing to pass up a little extra income to stay where they like it and where they feel comfortable.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 23:08:41 GMT -6
The revenue Miami and kent state can pull in in football alone is so good being in the Mac. To jump from an FCS football school to an fbs program is a big jump, actually. Kent state is going to a bowl...what bowl will usd and SDSU be going to ever? None? Oh ok. Bigggg difference.
I don't think it's that telling that Williams brought koupal and Lavin with him, and coaching at the alma mater isn't everything. If it was, nick saban would not be at Alabama, Paul beat Bryant would've never coached there and urban Meyer wouldn't be at Ohio state. How many coaches actually end their career at their alma mater? Very, very few.
|
|
|
Post by Coyote Fan on Dec 13, 2012 23:10:24 GMT -6
Well CF#1 if you say that there is no turnover problem, than there is no turnover problem, no questions asked. Just as you said that without a doubt that Iowa State was better than Iowa and you also said that you were unbiased when making that claim. Nevermind things like facts when they get in the way. The fact is within the past 3 years 3 succesful people left USD. The reasons are what they are but it doesn't change that they left.
I think we have to say that is at least a little bit of a knock against USD if not alot of a knock against USD.
Things are far from pretty right now with athletics. People are leaving, programs are losing, fans are as disinterested as ever. Maybe Sayler didn't leave USD in as good of shape as is often made out to be including by myself.
|
|
|
Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Dec 13, 2012 23:25:41 GMT -6
Take a look at joe lunardi's bracketology...Iowa isn't even mention but Iowa state is, even after Iowa beat Iowa state...gosh, guess you know more than espn's lunardi.
When talking about turnover, how long has gotts, huber and now Olympian Derek miles been here? A while. There's some loyalty and they aren't breaking the bank. I am sure boots had his chances in the d-2 days. Three people leave and there's a turnover problem? Arkansas state can't keep coaches for football on a yearly basis. Cincinnati has a new coach every three years in football and Tennessee has a new ad and three new coaches for football alone, plus the Bruce pearl situation in the last six years.
Call me when more than 3 people and a couple of assistants leave. You call for coaches heads and change and complain about turnover, interesting.
|
|
chuck
Sophomore Member
Posts: 169
|
Post by chuck on Dec 14, 2012 8:25:54 GMT -6
With all due respect, let's not overthink it. USD has hired talented, effective individuals (e.g., Saylor, Williams) who were eventually qualified to take higher paying jobs at institutions who play at a higher level of competition. This happens everywhere--for example, successful Missouri Valley basketball coaches never stay long. If we hire good people and they are successful, there is a chance they will move on. I don't see this as a systemic problem--it is what it is. End of story.
|
|
|
Post by Cousin Eddie on Dec 14, 2012 8:31:23 GMT -6
If guys are leaving for BETTER jobs, rather than leaving for LATERAL jobs, it means we are hiring good people. It also means we aren't playing it safe. You can't make hires in fear that the guy might leave for greener pastures. If you do that, you will never get the BEST people.
|
|
|
Post by Iceman on Dec 14, 2012 10:11:21 GMT -6
I don't think USD has a turnover problem. Like some have mentioned, if you leave for a better job, that means they are doing well and USD did a good job hiring you in the first place.
I am also a coach and when I was in college, some of us used to talk about coaching in the future. There was one guy we would argue with to the death on this issue. His philosophy was that if you weren't always trying to get a coaching job at a bigger or better school, there must be something wrong with you and you must not be a good coach. He said EVERY coaches goal is to keep moving up to get to the highest level or get to one of the best programs. I think this is a joke. So if a coach is happy with where they are at, why should they move up? Maybe that is the job that they have always wanted, even if it is at a high school or a smaller college. Like a few have mentioned, AJ or even Stig. They have been there awhile, they aren't moving on. They are probably satisfied with where they are. What is wrong with that?
Same thing with Boots, or Gottsleben or Huber. They have been around for awhile. So my point is, coaches have different coaching goals. Some want to keep moving up like Williams or even Sayler at AD, others want to stay where they are at. Are either of these wrong? Not in my opinion.
|
|
|
Post by 59coyote on Dec 14, 2012 13:15:50 GMT -6
Ryun Williams grew up in Wyoming and now is closer to family Chad Lavin's wife has always wanted to go back to that area and Chad coached at Wyoming for 11 years. Retirement place? Mandy said it was the hardest decision she ever made but for career reasons she had to do it. After more experience and if our job opened up, my bet is she would jump at an opportunity to come back. Be positive!!
|
|