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Post by Yote 53 on Oct 25, 2011 15:36:10 GMT -6
But you do realize that a new D1 NCC is exactly what a lot of USD fans want. I'm sure some of them would be happy if the Summit picked up Augustana.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Oct 25, 2011 15:53:44 GMT -6
But you do realize that a new D1 NCC is exactly what a lot of USD fans want. I'm sure some of them would be happy if the Summit picked up Augustana. You could not be more correct. Maybe the administration can try to get Morningside to move back up but this time 2 levels. Moving to D1 is going to inherently create more travel costs. How could it not when the NCC had most road trips be within a 6 hour circumference if not smaller than that.
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Post by pierreyote on Oct 25, 2011 18:57:58 GMT -6
But you do realize that a new D1 NCC is exactly what a lot of USD fans want. I'm sure some of them would be happy if the Summit picked up Augustana. You could not be more correct. Maybe the administration can try to get Morningside to move back up but this time 2 levels. Moving to D1 is going to inherently create more travel costs. How could it not when the NCC had most road trips be within a 6 hour circumference if not smaller than that. Thank you for such great insight but cost containment is also needed. Every darn school that is moving conferences, at our level, is doing so for the same reason. Control costs and reduce travel. I guess we will just have to agree to disagree. Why should you care? You proclaimed yourself a jackrabbit fan.
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Post by yotefan90 on Oct 25, 2011 19:04:21 GMT -6
As with most divisive issues, there is black and there is white, but there is usually a substantial number of people that are in the middle and that is where I found (find) myself on this topic. I have no problem with the Big Sky and was OK with the decision to go that way when it was our best option to protect the future of the FB program. But even then, I didn't like that from that point forward, I was very seldom going to be able to personally attend any more away conference FB or BB games as the vast footprint of the Sky makes that highly unlikely. Does it stop everyone? Of course not, but there is a substantial number of fans that would no longer get to see an away conference game of any sort without significant travel. UND and UNC as the closest conference games qualify as the only 2 that I could even consider. Big Sky has an outstanding conference TV package so many games would be viewable, but especially in the case of BB, it would make for a late night. Away games would miss the deadline for the next day's paper (I am old school).
Did I prefer the MVFC/Summit option when presented? Of course I did, but for selfish reasons. The number of games I will personally attend increased. The fact that I was much more familiar, both because of the past foes as well as the fact that State had been playing the others for several years put them all on my radar so I feel like I know a little something about them all. Would I have learned about the Sky schools? Sure, but the travel was still the drawback. I still recognize both conferences for what they are, Sky is more stable while Summit is more transitional. But what I wondered at the time and still do today, is if the the Sky is still as attractive if one or both Montanas leave? ORU left today and so the immediate reaction is the Sky is our better option long term. But if the Montanas leave tomorrow, would we be any better off?
I don't want NCC 2.0 but part of my desire to travel to some away games means that there will be a few of those schools in our conference. I do hope that we are able to pick up a school further east to give our eastern partners better travel options but I (like all the fans I associate with at each game) am in no way looking for a re-creation of the NCC.
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Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Oct 26, 2011 3:15:36 GMT -6
USD to the Big Sky is the equivalent of TCU in the Big East...how did that go again? Oh, it didn't. Besides about three to four people on this board, the fan base would have been mildly excited to face Montana and UND. Northern Colorado is an after thought and most people don't even know where Weber State is or what it is.
Yes, it was not all about SDSU, but also NDSU and schools in the area that people can recognize. UNO will definitely help that too. Heck, people showed up for Augie because it was a local game and they sucked at football. Even Minnesota State-Mankato was a big game for USD in basketball and football toward the end.
So don't tell me having regional teams around that the fan base can be familiar does not matter. The GWC offers quality home opponents in football and no one shows up. But they will show up for SDSU and NDSU.
I really doubt the same can be said for Weber State and Northern Arizona.
Is the Big Sky a pretty good conference? Damn straight! But does it have what USD needs, not necessarily. Plus that's extra costs for travel, and since we all know how USD is doing for fundraising, that might cost a coach for bball and football ... think about that for a minute. Or don't, some of you don't think about consequences.
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Post by Yote 53 on Oct 26, 2011 7:54:08 GMT -6
I think about consequences. The consequences are the Summit could very easily cease to exist or be a viable conference. I think many of you fail to grasp how easily this could happen. We can all agree that with what is going on in the Big East there is going to be more movement at the top. That movement is going to trickle down and open up options for Summit schools to leave, especially those on the eastern edge of the conference. When that happens, look out, the Summit will implode.
I maintain if USD would have gone to the BSC the balance of power would have shifted and, with this latest Summit defection, the Summit would be on the brink and SDSU and NDSU would have been looking to join the BSC (UNO would have probably not entered the picture either). An eastern BSC with USD, SDSU, UND, NDSU, UNC, and the Montanas would have been pretty awesome. Instead we are in a conference where everyone has an exit strategy.
As for quality names in the conference, I doubt your average student can name, or even recognize, half the teams in the Summit. At least I had heard of Weber St. I know where Northern Arizona is. A few people came to see the Yotes play Eastern Washington and Southern Utah this year. Everyone knows who Montana and Montana St are, and we have history with UNC.
That, and travel wouldn't be as bad in the BSC as it is right now in the Great West (w/includes New Jersey, Houston, and all points in between). Heck, a plane ride is a plane ride whether it's to Indiana, Detroit...or Washington, Utah. I've spoken with enough coaches about this who told me Big Sky travel was not an issue.
What the Summit/MVFC needs to do now is extend an offer to UND in the west and a school like Eastern Illinois in the east in order to protect itself. Yes, the MVFC needs to be proactive and get in protection mode as any more Summit defections will very negatively affect USD, SDSU, NDSU, and WIU. The BSC could come back into play.
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Post by #1CoyoteFan (Admin) on Oct 26, 2011 11:57:24 GMT -6
Yote 53, you are obviously freaking out and being naive. If you think the Summit can dissolve, then why can't the Big Sky with the two Montana schools? It has already been talked about, so why wouldn't it pop back up? If you are so certain about the Summit but yet you are going to deny this about the Montana schools, then you are just being naive.
You know Weber State and you know of Northern Arizona, but many people have not. You are a big fan, many are not as big.
Let's be honest here, without Oral Roberts, the Summit is still a better basketball league than the Big Sky. Regardless of what the RPI says, whoever makes the tournament from the Summit to the NCAA will be talked about on ESPN. That goes a long ways.
Heck, SDSU is already getting talked about on ESPN because of Nate Wolters. Oakland is getting talk about, too. Oral Roberts was not. The Big Sky is not a good basketball conference.
The coaches can say what they want about travel and that it would be a non-issue, but the football team has trouble traveling to Normal, Ill. How much worse would a trip to EWU be? Also, if you haven't noticed, flights have been going up in price, so the longer the trip, the more it costs ... like I said, that could cost the football team a coach with all of the players that have to travel.
Yes, the Big Sky is a good conference, but the Summit is not going to crumble.
This isn't the Big East. The Big East is crumbling because it hasn't had quality football in a decade. In fact, the MVFC has been way more stable than the Big East over the past decade when Miami and Va. Tech bolted for the ACC.
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Post by pierreyote on Oct 26, 2011 14:06:46 GMT -6
Reading the tea leaves here but I think the changes in the OVC will lead to Eastern Illinois coming back to Summit/MVFC. Belmont is joining the OVC next year. They are located in Nashville, Tennessee. The OVC also desires to admit NKU. The OVC is also in talks with U North Alabama. The move alone of adding Belmont and the subsequent possible moves make EIU a larger outlier for the OVC. Briniging in EIU is an absolute home run geographically for the eastern MVFC schools that don't want to come west more than once a year. It is also a home run for the eastern Summit schools. It creates a nice WIU v. EIU rival type game. Something Douple desires.
For the distance minded. EIU is only 60 miles further from Vermillion than the 2nd closest Big Sky (UNColo).
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Post by GoYotes on Oct 26, 2011 15:28:21 GMT -6
Does the MVFC want another team? I thought that is why the Yotes didn't get in until after UND was in the Big Sky and the 2 were no longer a package deal
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Post by Yote 53 on Oct 26, 2011 15:35:21 GMT -6
The eastern MVFC schools didn't want another long distance Dakota school, especially UND who would have been the farthest for them of all. If the MVFC brought in EIU then UND could maybe be offered making the MVFC 12 teams with an east/west format. Not bad.
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Post by GoYotes on Oct 26, 2011 15:52:29 GMT -6
Adding EIU & UND to both the MVFC & Summit would be great.
I wonder about Youngstown's long term plans as they are the only non Summit or MVC team in the MVFC. Can't imagine them leaving the Horizon to join the Summit, but if the Big East basketball schools break away they may pick off some Horizon teams. Like I have said before, still a lot of cards to be played in this game. They are a long ways east and has also been talks of them joining an east coast conference in all sports.
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Post by Coyote Fan on Oct 26, 2011 16:53:07 GMT -6
I like the thought of UND and Eastern Illinois to the Summit, I actually like it alot. In my perfect world the Summit would be a 12 team conference with a full round robin. It would alleviate the scheduling issues in basketball but still leave plenty of room for non conference opponents. More rivalries and more reason for meaning to the schedule.
East
IPFW, IUPUI, W Ill, E Ill, Oakland, Northern Kentucky
West
UND NDSU SDSU South Dakota UNO UMKC - If I could replace UMKC with someone like Minnesota State or a Missouri school I would
For football I am not as picky. I would like to see a 12 team Missouri Valley FC divided into two 6 team divisions. Each team plays 5 division games and 3 non division every year or 4 non division every year depending on the amount of non con games that the schools want.
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Post by tjbison on Oct 26, 2011 18:59:12 GMT -6
I'll also add that UND is not coming back anytime soon. By all appearances they are happy with the BSC and the opportunity that conference gives them to raise the profile of their school. Edited: I also want to add that there are plenty of fans on both the SDSU and NDSU message boards that think their AD's need to get on the horn to the BSC now and see about joining that conference. Gee, if USD would have joined the BSC when we had the chance there probably would be no UNO in the Summit and the SU's would be beating down Fullerton's door to get in the BSC along with UND and USD. We could have had conference stability and the SDSU game you all want so much. really??? who and where were these plenty of fans saying we need to run to the Big Sky??
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Post by Yote 53 on Oct 26, 2011 21:31:05 GMT -6
Have you read your own message board lately, TJ? There are quite s few Bison fans who think your AD should be calling the Sky right now.
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Post by pierreyote on Oct 26, 2011 21:49:03 GMT -6
Tjbison. Look at the other Bizon poster on this thread. That would be a solid start.
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