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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 13:46:53 GMT -6
I know I am the resident Nebraska guy and I am posting an article discussing the Huskers, but I am trying to use this as a catalyst for a higher level discussion. The topic in this article is a comparison of Nebraska and Iowa football. The numbers are staggering to me and I don't know where I stand on the topic yet, but it resurrects a discussion that he taken place on here. Coaching consistency vs. cutting bait and starting over. Read and discuss: www.omaha.com/huskers/blogs/mad-chatter-huskers-hawkeyes-and-the-pursuit-of-happiness-how/article_bcd42778-8c8d-11e5-9916-bbad54c028db.htmlMaybe this is the Nebraska homer in me (or my relative youth), but I tend to believe in the promise of the next opportunity. So, I guess I tend to believe if it doesn't work, try something new, but this has me thinking. ***The comments later in the article about Bo are fantastic. |
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Post by Yote 53 on Nov 16, 2015 15:07:54 GMT -6
LOL. I notice the writer stopped short of comparing Top 10 seasons. Iowa 4 - Nebraska 1
That writer was kind of spot on though. Nebraska just hasn't grasped the new reality of college football and how irrelevant the Huskers are in it. Today everybody is on TV, everybody has strength & conditioning programs, everybody has awesome facilities. There really is no difference between Iowa and Nebraska with the exception of two things. Iowa has consistency in its program, Nebraska is in constant turmoil. Iowa knows it is a developmental program and there will be ebbs and flows, some seasons good, some seasons subpar, Nebraska still thinks it's the 1990's and they should dominate every game of every season. It's unrealistic expectations. For years Husker fans had derided the Big Ten, calling it weak, and expected to roll into the conference and take it over, instead they are losing consistently to Minnesota, Northwestern, and now letting Purdue put up 55 on them in an embarassing loss, but I guess that's better than Texas Tech dropping 77 on them back in the day. So much for dominating. I always told my Husker friends the Northwestern Wildcats were a PITA, now I think they are finally beginning to understand.
If Nebraska fires their coach after this season it will be the biggest mistake they have made to date. Well, the first big mistake was hiring Mike Riley but you are stuck with him now for at least a few seasons. Firing a coach after his first year would make that program toxic to every decent coach in the country. Who would want to go to a program that fires coaches who have consistent 9-10 win seasons* and who fire a coach after 1 season? Especially given all the other coaching vacancies out there this season?
How does this relate to USD? Well, we needed some stability around here and Joe has provided that. Even though we lost to State I can see the improvement in the program. Every other MVFC fan has noticed it too. We aren't the butt of jokes anymore. I'd be for giving Joe one more year to see if he can complete the turnaround.
Oh, and GO HAWKS!!!
*Whether you believed Bo had to go or not he is still respected in coaching circles and what happened to him there is not a good mark for UNL. Many of his issues came from the toxic envirnment around him created by the Nebraska media and fanbase and unrealistic expectations put on the program. His players were very loyal to him and played hard for him. He took all the scrutiny that team received and did what a good head coach does, put the focus all on him and protected his players. Even for all his oubursts he still had a tender heart and reached out to do good things for people, and even took the time to laugh at himself...and his cat. I've heard fans say there are still "Bolievers" on the squad and how they need to be stamped out for not falling in line with the new regime. LOL, what did you guys really expect?
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 16:27:05 GMT -6
LOL. I notice the writer stopped short of comparing Top 10 seasons. Iowa 4 - Nebraska 1 That writer was kind of spot on though. Nebraska just hasn't grasped the new reality of college football and how irrelevant the Huskers are in it. Today everybody is on TV, everybody has strength & conditioning programs, everybody has awesome facilities. There really is no difference between Iowa and Nebraska with the exception of two things. Iowa has consistency in its program, Nebraska is in constant turmoil. Iowa knows it is a developmental program and there will be ebbs and flows, some seasons good, some seasons subpar, Nebraska still thinks it's the 1990's and they should dominate every game of every season. It's unrealistic expectations. For years Husker fans had derided the Big Ten, calling it weak, and expected to roll into the conference and take it over, instead they are losing consistently to Minnesota, Northwestern, and now letting Purdue put up 55 on them in an embarassing loss, but I guess that's better than Texas Tech dropping 77 on them back in the day. So much for dominating. I always told my Husker friends the Northwestern Wildcats were a PITA, now I think they are finally beginning to understand. If Nebraska fires their coach after this season it will be the biggest mistake they have made to date. Well, the first big mistake was hiring Mike Riley but you are stuck with him now for at least a few seasons. Firing a coach after his first year would make that program toxic to every decent coach in the country. Who would want to go to a program that fires coaches who have consistent 9-10 win seasons* and who fire a coach after 1 season? Especially given all the other coaching vacancies out there this season? How does this relate to USD? Well, we needed some stability around here and Joe has provided that. Even though we lost to State I can see the improvement in the program. Every other MVFC fan has noticed it too. We aren't the butt of jokes anymore. I'd be for giving Joe one more year to see if he can complete the turnaround. Oh, and GO HAWKS!!! *Whether you believed Bo had to go or not he is still respected in coaching circles and what happened to him there is not a good mark for UNL. Many of his issues came from the toxic envirnment around him created by the Nebraska media and fanbase and unrealistic expectations put on the program. His players were very loyal to him and played hard for him. He took all the scrutiny that team received and did what a good head coach does, put the focus all on him and protected his players. Even for all his oubursts he still had a tender heart and reached out to do good things for people, and even took the time to laugh at himself...and his cat. I've heard fans say there are still "Bolievers" on the squad and how they need to be stamped out for not falling in line with the new regime. LOL, what did you guys really expect? This is one of the dumbest diatribes I have ever read. There is so much wrong here, it isn't even funny. Whatever - for another time. To address your question about how this relates to USD, it is fairly straight forward. I am a little confused as to how you can't pick it up, being as you are an admin of the board and presumably read most things...but you are an Iowa fan, so...nevermind. There have been a multitude of discussions, whether with merit or not, about the need (or lack thereof) for a change of leadership with the coaching staff. Specifically, between Coyote Fan and yoteforever, among others. CF has taken the extreme approach on his end, no doubt, but they are on opposite sides. One of the pillars of YF's position has been the need for stability in the coaching staff. I strongly respect the views of YF on Coyote Athletics, but, if I am being honest, have asked myself (mostly when I am frustrated with the outcome of a game or season) whether I agree. Does it make sense to hold a staff together if they aren't showing signs of success on the field or in the W-L columns? Can a change of leadership quickly right the ship? Is a change in leadership enough or are other factors (funding, facilities, location, etc.) more important? If you accept the position that stability is of significant value, then the ultimate question is "how much time is necessary to prove that you are on the right track?" My opinion is that the minimum is 4 years - one cycle of recruits, although I tend to believe that the best practice is 6 years - The first year of recruiting is never a full recruiting/scouting season, then you need 5 years to allow for the first class to have 4 years of eligibility, plus a RS year. Nobody can question whether USD is on the upswing. I think that is clear. But, what happens if Joe does retire? Do you start fresh or promote from within? We don't need to talk specifics now, nor should we, but I think the philosophy of the question posed by the article is interesting and worthy of discussion. If we need another example, State College is prime. There was plenty of talk about Stig 4+ years ago. Their patience has (mostly) paid off. Thoughts? |
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 16:30:21 GMT -6
I don't know what circles you run in or talk to but to even imply that Bo Pelini has even a modicum of the respect that Mike Riley has in coaching circles, you are on heavy drugs. One only need to look at resumes and assistant coaches. It isn't even in the same stratosphere.
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Post by Yotes on Nov 16, 2015 16:34:02 GMT -6
Damn tired of hearing about Iowa fans and their football team stumbling through the easiest schedule they could have ever asked for. Don't tell me they are consistently successful either. Very recently got blasted by a crap Tenneessee team in last year's bowl game and are not far removed from a 8 or 9 loss season.
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 16:39:12 GMT -6
Damn tired of hearing about Iowa fans and their football team stumbling through the easiest schedule they could have ever asked for. Don't tell me they are consistently successful either. Very recently got blasted by a crap Tenneessee team in last year's bowl game and are not far removed from a 8 or 9 loss season. Hold tight, yotes. They still need to finish - their aren't anymore ties for conference championships in the B1G. |
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Post by Yote 53 on Nov 16, 2015 16:40:02 GMT -6
Yep. You are a Nebraska fan. This is just never gonna work. Let's just agree to disagree on the state of your program over the last 15 years and the direction it is currently headed.
I picked up, and addressed how this relates to USD. YFE and CF have gone round and round on this subject. YFE is of the Iowa train of thought of needing consistency in the program and allowing time to build. CF is of the Nebraska train of thought where they fire coaches for not meeting unrealistic expectations and that new blood is what is needed to take the program to the next level.
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Post by Yote 53 on Nov 16, 2015 16:45:19 GMT -6
I should have said Nebraska fan(s) because they are coming out of the woodwork now. I guess a referee giftwrapped win against the Spartans has emboldened them. You crap on Iowa's schedule and call it weak yet you can't win conference games, go figure. Also, Pitt > Miami. Iowa beat Pitt, Nebraska lost to Miami. If Iowa's schedule is weak, what is Nebraska's? And you can't even win with it?
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Post by coyotecrazie5 on Nov 16, 2015 16:52:38 GMT -6
As a fan of neither team, Nebraska was gifted that win against MSU and Iowa's schedule is terrible. I actually think it would be a close game against the two. Tenn. is not a bad team, they just have a very tough schedule. I think Iowa gets taken to the wood shed in the B1GCG.
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obc
Senior Member
Posts: 784
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Post by obc on Nov 16, 2015 17:06:18 GMT -6
LOL. I notice the writer stopped short of comparing Top 10 seasons. Iowa 4 - Nebraska 1 That writer was kind of spot on though. Nebraska just hasn't grasped the new reality of college football and how irrelevant the Huskers are in it. Today everybody is on TV, everybody has strength & conditioning programs, everybody has awesome facilities. There really is no difference between Iowa and Nebraska with the exception of two things. Iowa has consistency in its program, Nebraska is in constant turmoil. Iowa knows it is a developmental program and there will be ebbs and flows, some seasons good, some seasons subpar, Nebraska still thinks it's the 1990's and they should dominate every game of every season. It's unrealistic expectations. For years Husker fans had derided the Big Ten, calling it weak, and expected to roll into the conference and take it over, instead they are losing consistently to Minnesota, Northwestern, and now letting Purdue put up 55 on them in an embarassing loss, but I guess that's better than Texas Tech dropping 77 on them back in the day. So much for dominating. I always told my Husker friends the Northwestern Wildcats were a PITA, now I think they are finally beginning to understand. If Nebraska fires their coach after this season it will be the biggest mistake they have made to date. Well, the first big mistake was hiring Mike Riley but you are stuck with him now for at least a few seasons. Firing a coach after his first year would make that program toxic to every decent coach in the country. Who would want to go to a program that fires coaches who have consistent 9-10 win seasons* and who fire a coach after 1 season? Especially given all the other coaching vacancies out there this season? How does this relate to USD? Well, we needed some stability around here and Joe has provided that. Even though we lost to State I can see the improvement in the program. Every other MVFC fan has noticed it too. We aren't the butt of jokes anymore. I'd be for giving Joe one more year to see if he can complete the turnaround. Oh, and GO HAWKS!!! *Whether you believed Bo had to go or not he is still respected in coaching circles and what happened to him there is not a good mark for UNL. Many of his issues came from the toxic envirnment around him created by the Nebraska media and fanbase and unrealistic expectations put on the program. His players were very loyal to him and played hard for him. He took all the scrutiny that team received and did what a good head coach does, put the focus all on him and protected his players. Even for all his oubursts he still had a tender heart and reached out to do good things for people, and even took the time to laugh at himself...and his cat. I've heard fans say there are still "Bolievers" on the squad and how they need to be stamped out for not falling in line with the new regime. LOL, what did you guys really expect? This is one of the dumbest diatribes I have ever read. There is so much wrong here, it isn't even funny. Whatever - for another time. To address your question about how this relates to USD, it is fairly straight forward. I am a little confused as to how you can't pick it up, being as you are an admin of the board and presumably read most things...but you are an Iowa fan, so...nevermind. There have been a multitude of discussions, whether with merit or not, about the need (or lack thereof) for a change of leadership with the coaching staff. Specifically, between Coyote Fan and yoteforever, among others. CF has taken the extreme approach on his end, no doubt, but they are on opposite sides. One of the pillars of YF's position has been the need for stability in the coaching staff. I strongly respect the views of YF on Coyote Athletics, but, if I am being honest, have asked myself (mostly when I am frustrated with the outcome of a game or season) whether I agree. Does it make sense to hold a staff together if they aren't showing signs of success on the field or in the W-L columns? Can a change of leadership quickly right the ship? Is a change in leadership enough or are other factors (funding, facilities, location, etc.) more important? If you accept the position that stability is of significant value, then the ultimate question is "how much time is necessary to prove that you are on the right track?" My opinion is that the minimum is 4 years - one cycle of recruits, although I tend to believe that the best practice is 6 years - The first year of recruiting is never a full recruiting/scouting season, then you need 5 years to allow for the first class to have 4 years of eligibility, plus a RS year. Nobody can question whether USD is on the upswing. I think that is clear. But, what happens if Joe does retire? Do you start fresh or promote from within? We don't need to talk specifics now, nor should we, but I think the philosophy of the question posed by the article is interesting and worthy of discussion. If we need another example, State College is prime. There was plenty of talk about Stig 4+ years ago. Their patience has (mostly) paid off. Thoughts? How much time you give a coach and his staff to turn things around perhaps should take into account where the program is and how steep of a rebuild they have. Look at Bohl in Wyoming. He appeared to be (and I believe btw) a great coach at NDSU. Now at Wyoming he is getting curb stomped weekly. Is he a bad coach now - I say no. Vermillion like Laramie is a tough place to win in. At least Wyoming is well funded comparatively. USD is adding resources but it has been hard to overcome the 25 years of financial starvation. The FB team still needs another full time coach (paid) on staff. I was as down on this staff as probably anyone, but we are starting to see some confidence and life. I have also wondered about the coordinators. They have struggled the past four years at times, but the second half of this season have done much better. As a program, USD has paid the tuition on their MVFC experience education with some brutal losses. If I was in charge (thank God I am not) next year's season would be the year it is do or die for the staff from a win/loss respect. Winning record in the MVFC next year needs to be the minimum expectation. |
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 17:09:00 GMT -6
Yep. You are a Nebraska fan. This is just never gonna work. Let's just agree to disagree on the state of your program over the last 15 years and the direction it is currently headed. I picked up, and addressed how this relates to USD. YFE and CF have gone round and round on this subject. YFE is of the Iowa train of thought of needing consistency in the program and allowing time to build. CF is of the Nebraska train of thought where they fire coaches for not meeting unrealistic expectations and that new blood is what is needed to take the program to the next level. Sure. The thing is, I never said anything to discredit Iowa when I started this thread - so I guess that makes you a typical Iowa fan? You had to be classy and derail everything. Nice work. Are their fools that think Mike Riley should be canned, I am sure their are some idiots that still want a coach that costs his team and players games by making himself a fool on the sidelines, but I am not one. Dear God, did you see what he did in the YSU vs. NDSU game. He should be fired just for that. I feel terrible for those players. I have faith in Mike Riley and I like the way he is building the program in a respectable manner. Again, he needs to finish, but you can only do so much with what your predecessor left you. Bo didn't know how to manage his team or himself. You can choose to believe me or not, but the product on the field for most of this season has been a result of his roster management, his "us against the world" mentality and his poor overall player development. All one needs to do is look at the depth chart at QB, DE, LB and OL to realize this. Not once in his 7 years did he even fill up on the 85 allotted scholarships. That MSU comment is just a throw away. A loser's complaint. Bad calls happen all the time. It wasn't the last play of the game. Nebraska had two more plays to go and room for another first down. The momentum was going their way. I can post 3-4 different angles of the complete video of the play. The call is completely defensible, if not text book correct. The conference defended the decision as well. |
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 17:16:14 GMT -6
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Post by Cousin Eddie on Nov 16, 2015 17:24:05 GMT -6
LOL. I notice the writer stopped short of comparing Top 10 seasons. Iowa 4 - Nebraska 1 Top to bottom, left to right. It's called reading. The first thing the writer says under "Iowa owns an edge in..." he says: Iowa owns an edge in... Top-10 seasons:
Nebraska 1 (2001)
Iowa 4 (’02, ’03, ’04, ’09)BCS/Major bowls: Nebraska 1 (Rose after ’01 season) Iowa 2 (Orange ’02, Orange ’09) Conference championships: Nebraska 0 Iowa 2* * Both titles aren’t quite as they seem. The Hawks went 8-0 in ’02, but didn’t play national champion Ohio State. In ’04, they tied Michigan at 7-1, but the Wolverines won head-to-head. Nebraska has an edge in... Top-25 seasons: Nebraska 9 Iowa 5 |
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Post by coyotecrazie5 on Nov 16, 2015 17:50:02 GMT -6
Like I said, not a fan of either team, but the wr was not forced out of bounds and should have been called for illegal touching in my unbiased opinion. Great win for Nebraska, they have had such a roller coaster season with bad losses. It seemed like karma that they got one to go their way.
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ctc2010
Sophomore Member
Posts: 238 
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Post by ctc2010 on Nov 16, 2015 18:23:53 GMT -6
Seeing Pelini implode like that makes me so thankful we have someone like Joe leading our team and setting such a good example for those young men
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