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Post by Yotes on Apr 1, 2022 15:32:14 GMT -6
They also have this gem today:
All in favor of outlawing April Fools Day?
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Post by gopheryote on Apr 2, 2022 9:01:03 GMT -6
To me, maybe the most telling is that almost everyone agrees with the premise of SL football. Except, apparently, AD's and university presidents.
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Post by Yotes on Apr 2, 2022 9:30:50 GMT -6
The Summit already has 5 teams that play scholarship football. Same as the Great West did. Let's say those 5 broke off and made their own football conference. Play 4 tough league games, then barnstorm around the FCS beating up on the Big Sky, OVC, CAA, whatever Southern conferences still exist. I bet 3-4 of the 5 Summit teams still get 8+ wins and playoff bids each year.
Irrational pipe dream, I know. It just sounds better to have our collective all-sports fates decided by those in this together rather than having our football influenced by schools like Loyola/Drake/Bradley/Evansville. If we could get 2-3 more scholarship football programs in the Summit (for all sports) then I would be all for starting Summit Football. No one with options wants to be in a Dakota-centric conference though.
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Post by wrj on Apr 2, 2022 10:57:32 GMT -6
So, let's play pretend and lead ourselves to some not necessarily rational questions. If Northern Colorado joined the Summit and brought football and became a travel partner with Denver; if Omaha brought back football, or St. Thomas added scholarships, or Oral Roberts added American football, or some other school brought football to the Summit to bring the number of Summit football teams to seven, or more, would this lead to either enticement, or leverage for other schools to join the Summit? (Please don't show that last sentence to my English teacher.) Could Northern Iowa be influenced to join the Summit? They could be the basketball travel partner with St. Tom. How about Missouri State?
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Post by Yotes on Apr 2, 2022 11:45:17 GMT -6
MVC schools wouldn't dream of switching to Summit. Their basketball conference is too valuable. They can actually get an at-large bid there. Not to mention the general disdain UNI (and I'm sure others) generally seem to have for the Dakota schools.
UNC gets brought up by many, but they fit much better geographically in the Big Sky and when they do have to travel it is somewhere interesting (you can sell that to a recruit). I think we would have to give them the basketball tournament or something grand to get UNC in the Summit.
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Post by kiyoat on Apr 2, 2022 12:18:33 GMT -6
Also keep it in mind that team sports require a minimum of 6 teams in NCAA D-1. At least, that’s what is required in order for it to count towards BB tournament eligibility.
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Post by Yotes on Apr 2, 2022 12:45:39 GMT -6
Also keep it in mind that team sports require a minimum of 6 teams in NCAA D-1. At least, that’s what is required in order for it to count towards BB tournament eligibility. I believe that is just for a conference to receive an automatic bid to the tournament. That's probably why the Great West was okay at 5 teams. None of the schools were eligible for postseason play anyways. Hypothetically, if a school was eligible in that conference and earned an at-large bid they would go to the playoffs. Same as an independent would. But yes, a 5-team conference is a poor idea. Anything less than 8 really. |
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Post by yoteforever on Apr 2, 2022 15:44:08 GMT -6
Think about this league and is not a pipe dream.
UND, NDSU, USD, SDSU, MONTANA, MONTANA STATE, IDAHO, IDAHO STATE, UNC, and NORTHERN ARIZONA or WEBER STATE
10 team all sports league. BIg Sky schools finally dump the California schools.
Then UNI and MISSOURI STATE if they come as a pair ( which I do t think they will )
Now you have the footprint to play against Mountain West schools
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Post by yoteforever on Apr 2, 2022 15:47:44 GMT -6
The problem with the Big Sky and MVFC is TV audience. New league wouldn’t change it but would be on much more stable financial ground. As bad as I think NDSU and perhaps SDSU want to go up, I don’t think anyone wants them for same reason. Number of TV sets. That’s our problem as well. The new league would be stronger in all the revenue sports and would crest a number of regional rivalries.
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Post by Yotes on Apr 2, 2022 19:29:12 GMT -6
That reimagined Big Sky with the Dakotas in it is 100% our most ideal conference. It would be respectable competition all the way through, as regional as reasonably possible, a home for all sports, and our fates would be tied to others with the same priorities in mind.
It really is too bad that USD didn't stick with the Big Sky like UND did (no choice for them). Good chance the Summit would have collapsed and all 4 Dakotas would call the Big Sky home by now.
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Post by Yote 53 on Apr 4, 2022 10:09:25 GMT -6
That reimagined Big Sky with the Dakotas in it is 100% our most ideal conference. It would be respectable competition all the way through, as regional as reasonably possible, a home for all sports, and our fates would be tied to others with the same priorities in mind. It really is too bad that USD didn't stick with the Big Sky like UND did (no choice for them). Good chance the Summit would have collapsed and all 4 Dakotas would call the Big Sky home by now. That was the master plan back then. Would have worked too. By now we would be discussing, or would have already happened, the splitting of the Big Sky into the aforementioned conference. Part of me doesn't want that conference though because Montana & Idaho are so far away. Has anybody here made that drive from Bozeman or Missoula or Moscow, ID to Vermillion? Anywhere from 12-20 hour drive. I was always a proponent of that conference from a stability standpoint but man that conference would be spread out simply because the West is a really big place. Youngstown, OH is our farthest trip now and that is 14 hours. I like that the MVFC is a Midwestern conference and that is where we recruit from, that is where the East River schools are located, and all of our opponents are within reasonable driving distance, meaning you can make it there in a one day drive. Recruiting is a really big deal. I think it would be tougher recruiting Midwest kids to come here when all the games are played out West. I think we saw that play out with UND when they were in the Big Sky. I'm fine with the MVFC/Summit. I just hope someday that the Summit elevates to such a point, and the MVC moves in such a direction, that the MVC publics like UNI and Mo State see that joining up with the Dakotas in an all-sports conference is the best idea. An all-sports MVFC would be a great conference. To put all of the travel in perspective, would any of us advocate for USD to be in the same conference as Long Island University in NYC? Of course not. Vermillion to NYC is a 20 hour drive. |
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Post by kiyoat on Apr 4, 2022 11:01:46 GMT -6
I'm fine with the MVFC/Summit. I just hope someday that the Summit elevates to such a point, and the MVC moves in such a direction, that the MVC publics like UNI and Mo State see that joining up with the Dakotas in an all-sports conference is the best idea. ... I think that would require the MVC teams to realize that they aren't a two-bid conference with Loyola leaving, and Wichita State and Creighton before that. It will probably take a number of years before their attitude of superiority over the Dakotas will soften. Or maybe never. |
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Post by Yote 53 on Apr 4, 2022 11:07:34 GMT -6
To be fair, the Summit needs to do a better job in elevating our men's basketball programs. MVC is a top ten conference and we hover in the 20's.
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Post by Yotes on Apr 4, 2022 13:41:08 GMT -6
I'm fine with the MVFC/Summit. I just hope someday that the Summit elevates to such a point, and the MVC moves in such a direction, that the MVC publics like UNI and Mo State see that joining up with the Dakotas in an all-sports conference is the best idea. ... I think that would require the MVC teams to realize that they aren't a two-bid conference with Loyola leaving, and Wichita State and Creighton before that. It will probably take a number of years before their attitude of superiority over the Dakotas will soften. Or maybe never. They are trading Loyola (10-seed this year) for Murray (7-seed this year). They also add Belmont, who is another historically strong mid-major. I don't think their standing has downgraded at all with this change. Generally not a two-bid league unless there is an upset in the conference tournament. That's a damn sight better than the Summit though where 30 wins gets you a 13 seed. |
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Post by nodak651 on Jun 7, 2022 11:50:14 GMT -6
I think the Summit needs to look at adding football in order to lock a team like St. Thomas into the conference, should the MVC ever come calling. Given that St. Thomas is currently non scholly, however, bringing the NCHC under the Summit's wing makes better sense at the moment. Given that St. Thomas is looking to build a 4-4.5K seat hockey arena, I think Summit hockey could serve the same purpose, as I think St. Thomas would be unwilling to screw over their hockey program with a move to the Valley, as hockey looks to be very important to them, and it will generate millions in ticket revenue if that arena gets built. This would also lock Denver into the Summit, as well, should the WCC come calling. With those two programs locked up, Mankato would be the perfect geographic and institutional fit, should expansion be needed. They have good hockey and basketball facilities, but football would be a huge issue. They could potentially look at moving football to the pioneer with St. Thomas to help finance the move, and both schools could eventually look to add schollarships to their football programs, should a Summit Football conference eventually be desirable for all. I know Denver hates the idea of being in the same conference as Northern Colorado (they think of them like we do Augi), so if expansion is needed, I would be interested in looking at a travel partner for ORU and potentially another football program if Summit Football is in the cards - perhaps UCA, Abaline Christian, SFA, SEMO, or Lindenwood (depending how transition goes) would potentially be worth looking into as well, if needed. Air Force would also be ideal if they were to leave the MWC for some type of football only move, but that would be a huge long shot chance (a guy can dream right?).
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