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Post by Yotes on Sept 27, 2018 22:39:30 GMT -6
Yeah, Indiana State's two wins were a D2 school and 0-4 Eastern Illinois. Better than 0-11. Long way to go though.
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Post by Yote 53 on Sept 28, 2018 8:10:48 GMT -6
I must not be paying attention. I just realized that SDSU and NDSU are playing this weekend for that made up trophy they concocted.
I'm sorry, I am from a time when SDSU and NDSU weren't "rivals". I mean, all the Dakota schools have a long history of playing each other and they are big games, but rivalry status was always reserved for UND vs NDSU and USD vs SDSU. This whole NDSU and SDSU "rivalry" thing still feels forced. When UND joins the MVFC the "rivalries" should return to normal.
Oh, and bring back the Sitting Bull Trophy.
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Post by JWKunzman on Sept 28, 2018 8:25:07 GMT -6
I must not be paying attention. I just realized that SDSU and NDSU are playing this weekend for that made up trophy they concocted. I'm sorry, I am from a time when SDSU and NDSU weren't "rivals". I mean, all the Dakota schools have a long history of playing each other and they are big games, but rivalry status was always reserved for UND vs NDSU and USD vs SDSU. This whole NDSU and SDSU "rivalry" thing still feels forced. When UND joins the MVFC the "rivalries" should return to normal. Oh, and bring back the Sitting Bull Trophy. Unfortunately it doesn't work like that. Rivalries grow, shift, and develop over time. With NDSU and sdsu going to D1 together and getting to be pretty good the rivalry was there. I like the Dakota Marker trophy. Aren't all rivalry trophies "made up"?
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Post by coyotecrazie5 on Sept 28, 2018 8:27:16 GMT -6
I must not be paying attention. I just realized that SDSU and NDSU are playing this weekend for that made up trophy they concocted. I'm sorry, I am from a time when SDSU and NDSU weren't "rivals". I mean, all the Dakota schools have a long history of playing each other and they are big games, but rivalry status was always reserved for UND vs NDSU and USD vs SDSU. This whole NDSU and SDSU "rivalry" thing still feels forced. When UND joins the MVFC the "rivalries" should return to normal. Oh, and bring back the Sitting Bull Trophy. To play devil's advocate, is UND not our rival since they are not from the same state?
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Post by coyote70 on Sept 28, 2018 8:49:00 GMT -6
I don't think the Sitting Bull trophy will be coming back anytime soon, if for no other reason than the Standing Rock tribe would likely be staging protests at both universities. It's not a politically correct trophy for either school no matter what one thinks.
I think a new trophy would be okay given our long-standing rivalry and we have discussed this at length in a previous thread. I suggested a "flag" of some sort to symbolize the two flagship universities, but frankly it really doesn't matter that much. Hey, maybe we could have an ingrained map of Dakota Territory which preceded the Dakota markers. Call it the Dakota Territory Trophy.
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Post by kiyoat on Sept 28, 2018 9:36:11 GMT -6
I don't mind the Dakota Marker trophy, but I do think we need to bring a little more prominence to the existing trophies that have been around for much longer. The only way to do that is to win more and make those games mean more. The Sitting Bull Trophy and the Little Brown Jug need to be resurrected (and perhaps re-named in the case of Sitting Bull). Coach Stig has un-buried the Little Brown Jug. We just need to win the darn game.
Some perspective:
1862 USD founded . . 1881 SDSU founded 1883 UND founded 1889 first USD-SDSU football game (oldest public in-state football rivalry in the nation) 1890 NDSU founded 1894 first UND-NDSU football game . 1903 first USD-UND game & SDSU-NDSU game . . 1922 NCC formed 1927 Little Brown Jug Trophy . 1938 Nickel Trophy . 1953 Sitting Bull Trophy . . . . . 2004 Dakota Marker Trophy
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Post by sdyotefan on Sept 28, 2018 10:04:49 GMT -6
I remember the Sitting Bull trophy and think it would be great to bring back! It recognizes a great Sioux leader so I don't understand a contrived PC position to the contrary.
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Post by kiyoat on Sept 28, 2018 10:10:03 GMT -6
The Little Brown Jug is pretty small. It would be cool to affix it to a stand of some kind, I think. The game scores over the years could be on the stand. I think the fate of the Sitting Bull trophy name was set when the Fighting Sioux became the Fighting Hawks. That ship has sailed, I think. Agree or disagree, I think the name of the trophy will have to change. It would be a shame to just end it, though.
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Post by Yote 53 on Sept 28, 2018 11:41:05 GMT -6
You guys didn't pick up on the subtle irony in my post. UND is about as much our rival as NDSU is to SDSU.
Siting Bull isn't coming back and replacing it with some other contrived trophy would be just as bad, or worse, than the Dakota Marker. The Marker was completely made up because those two schools needed to have some marketing gimmick to get people excited for the only game they had against a known opponent after they both lost their primary rivals. Prior to that there was no NDSU/SDSU rivalry it was just another big game in the Dakotas, no different than when we play NDSU or UND.
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steelsd
Sophomore Member
Posts: 168
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Post by steelsd on Sept 28, 2018 17:07:51 GMT -6
You guys didn't pick up on the subtle irony in my post. UND is about as much our rival as NDSU is to SDSU. Siting Bull isn't coming back and replacing it with some other contrived trophy would be just as bad, or worse, than the Dakota Marker. The Marker was completely made up because those two schools needed to have some marketing gimmick to get people excited for the only game they had against a known opponent after they both lost their primary rivals. Prior to that there was no NDSU/SDSU rivalry it was just another big game in the Dakotas, no different than when we play NDSU or UND. I would say initially when we moved up the rivalry was forced. However, considering the success both teams have had in football and basketball the rivalry has developed and become real. Even as an old guy from the D2 days I can say I’m on board with it. Certainly there is still a rivalry with USD, but I guarantee you that the large percentage of students at SDSU view the Bison as our main rival.
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Post by Yotes on Sept 28, 2018 17:21:10 GMT -6
I propose we follow the Utah model of one collective battle for a trophy: en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Beehive_BootAll 4 schools play each other, the one with the best record gets the trophy. I don't care what that trophy is. It would be good bragging rights for the winner.
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 656
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Post by jackjd on Sept 28, 2018 18:24:41 GMT -6
Never mind.
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Post by elcoyote on Sept 28, 2018 22:24:08 GMT -6
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Post by gopheryote on Sept 29, 2018 6:01:11 GMT -6
steelsd is probably right. But it seems likely that 'rivalry' is being re-defined as 'most important game from a championship POV'. It seems like a local rivalry seems to grow as you age (ex - working in the same office as alumni from other schools). Example: The street I live on is a mix of USD/SDSU/Minnesota alumni, all with flags out on Saturdays. Zero NDSU or UND fans, so zero bragging rights in daily life. NDSU is a big game for USD too - it will be sold out, tailgating will be intense, etc., but it wouldn't be if both teams were 2-6. Both State/U games (when UND comes in) will matter even if both teams playing are having lousy seasons.
Question - does the xDSU game today even matter? Regardless of the outcome, aren't both all but guaranteed high playoff seeding based on current perceptions?
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Post by aldewitt on Sept 29, 2018 6:38:36 GMT -6
You guys didn't pick up on the subtle irony in my post. UND is about as much our rival as NDSU is to SDSU. Siting Bull isn't coming back and replacing it with some other contrived trophy would be just as bad, or worse, than the Dakota Marker. The Marker was completely made up because those two schools needed to have some marketing gimmick to get people excited for the only game they had against a known opponent after they both lost their primary rivals. Prior to that there was no NDSU/SDSU rivalry it was just another big game in the Dakotas, no different than when we play NDSU or UND. I'm not sure how many people come to the USD/SDSU games but the Marker games are the largest sporting events ever held in the Dakotas. Its a big game and a lot of fun.
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