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Post by Yote 53 on Nov 19, 2014 16:04:16 GMT -6
JackJD asked when this rivalry turned and correctly pointed out it was those years leading up to SDSU transitioning. Another question is why did it turn so poisonous? I would submit it was a result of the condescending, holier than thou attitude put out by State people during that time. There was a whole lot of attitude that SDSU was better than USD, "little brother" shots fired at USD, etc. Alot of that attitude still persists from SDSU fans. We just oblige you by firing back.
I know plenty of USD people that have lamented that it used to be fun to go up to State, party before the game, go to the bars, etc. Now nobody can stand going to Brookings or being around State people because "everything has changed about them."
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 663
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Post by jackjd on Nov 19, 2014 19:35:16 GMT -6
If the State fans had a "condescending, holier than thou attitude," I think that accusation can only apply for the period FOLLOWING the departure from Division II. I remember well the criticism thrown at SDSU by USD fans and I also remember well SDSU didn't fall flat on its face (as predicted by some) in the early transition (well, except for men's basketball)-- and, as a result, State fans were pretty pleased with what was going on and no doubt that was read as condescending. I guess how one perceived the various attitudes is a personal thing. For me, the annual $5. bet on made on the SDSU/USD football game just ended. Perhaps my USD friend betting against me thought I was condescending when I didn't call any more -- but, we weren't playing football so there was no reason to call.
I think the relationship was poisonous in the years before the actual departure from DII. Bottom line for me: the relationship was terrible and now it doesn't matter who was more at fault. A new form of the rivalry will develop.
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Post by yoteforever on Nov 20, 2014 9:14:05 GMT -6
If the State fans had a "condescending, holier than thou attitude," I think that accusation can only apply for the period FOLLOWING the departure from Division II. I remember well the criticism thrown at SDSU by USD fans and I also remember well SDSU didn't fall flat on its face (as predicted by some) in the early transition (well, except for men's basketball)-- and, as a result, State fans were pretty pleased with what was going on and no doubt that was read as condescending. I guess how one perceived the various attitudes is a personal thing. For me, the annual $5. bet on made on the SDSU/USD football game just ended. Perhaps my USD friend betting against me thought I was condescending when I didn't call any more -- but, we weren't playing football so there was no reason to call. I think the relationship was poisonous in the years before the actual departure from DII. Bottom line for me: the relationship was terrible and now it doesn't matter who was more at fault. A new form of the rivalry will develop. I actually think the "holier than thou attitude" is alive and well in Brookings. And in part is somewhat understandable because you did transition first to D1, and although I don't remember the USD fan base or administration taking shots at SDSU or hoping they'd fail, it probably did happen. Honestly, I had two schools of thought at the time. First, I didn't think any University in South Dakota could honestly afford it at the time, so therefore I didn't think you would do well. Secondly, once you and NDSU said you were going, I knew for a fact we had to go and we did, just later than we should have. So I do give credit for having the guts to go. That being said this is where the "holier than thou" attitude still prevails. That argument is brought up over and over and over and over and over till we all want to puke. There comes a time where it doesn't pertain anymore. I think we are past that, many of your fans don't. It's like us if we kept bringing up being the first University in the state. It happened over 150 years ago, who honestly cares? Then there is this status of sports at D1 level like many of the d2 teams of yesteryear couldn't even compete with these teams. I think that's wrong. My point is putting the letter D and the number 1 behind your schools name doesn't build any base of far better sports programs, only larger and more costlier ones. When the Coyotes played Eastern Washington a few years ago, we had just made the D 1 transition, yet we beat the number one team in FCS like a red headed step child in our Dome with basically D2 recruits. The gal between good D2 teams and FCS teams across the board isn't that large. But many of us felt, myself included, that the SDSU fans made it sound like they were Alabama in football, UCLA in basketball and so on. I guaranty you, you wouldn't have wanted to play the Coyotes when we were D2 and had Logan, and some of the other guys that were pretty incredible athletes for the Coyotes. We would have hung your asses out to dry in the Dome, I guaranty that. Joe Glenn is right. This won't be a rivalry game anymore until we beat you and make it significant. I could honestly care less who you, or your peers view as your rival. For all I care, you can play NDSU 12 times a year ( and you would be 0-12). The ultimate reason that the bantering that goes on is so strong is because deep down everyone knows it is a rivalry game to many. Maybe not all,but certainly to some. And when we finally gain the upper hand on you in football ( and we will) then I can see our fan base saying....this is SDSUs Super Bowl and our main rivalry is UNI. Whatever, it's a stupid argument. Lastly, if this isn't a rivalry,then why on the Bunny Board does a certain poster keep saying all we are are pieces of $hit? Because the dick smack knows it's a rivalry, that's why. HATE STATE |
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Post by nccyote on Nov 20, 2014 9:31:06 GMT -6
Lastly, if this isn't a rivalry,then why on the Bunny Board does a certain poster keep saying all we are are pieces of $hit? Because the dick smack knows it's a rivalry, that's why. HATE STATE I love it! Now this is getting fun. The only reason that state fans say that it is no longer a rivalry to them is because they know it cuts us deep. I agree that "the holier than thou" attitude is what rubs most U fans the wrong way. Everyone in SD knows, this game is the most important to both programs, in recruiting, in fundraising, in overall perception of the programs throughout the state. It is bigger than records, it is bigger than fan base vs. fan base. That is why it is one of the great rivalries of all time. |
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Post by nccyote on Nov 20, 2014 9:37:45 GMT -6
To the current players, the rivalry might be diminished a little bit, understandably so. But for the alumni & fans, this rivalry will never go away. Any bunny fan that says otherwise needs to pull their "holier than thou" head out of their a$$.
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Post by jackl on Nov 20, 2014 9:43:29 GMT -6
If the State fans had a "condescending, holier than thou attitude," I think that accusation can only apply for the period FOLLOWING the departure from Division II. I remember well the criticism thrown at SDSU by USD fans and I also remember well SDSU didn't fall flat on its face (as predicted by some) in the early transition (well, except for men's basketball)-- and, as a result, State fans were pretty pleased with what was going on and no doubt that was read as condescending. I guess how one perceived the various attitudes is a personal thing. For me, the annual $5. bet on made on the SDSU/USD football game just ended. Perhaps my USD friend betting against me thought I was condescending when I didn't call any more -- but, we weren't playing football so there was no reason to call. I think the relationship was poisonous in the years before the actual departure from DII. Bottom line for me: the relationship was terrible and now it doesn't matter who was more at fault. A new form of the rivalry will develop. I actually think the "holier than thou attitude" is alive and well in Brookings. And in part is somewhat understandable because you did transition first to D1, and although I don't remember the USD fan base or administration taking shots at SDSU or hoping they'd fail, it probably did happen. Honestly, I had two schools of thought at the time. First, I didn't think any University in South Dakota could honestly afford it at the time, so therefore I didn't think you would do well. Secondly, once you and NDSU said you were going, I knew for a fact we had to go and we did, just later than we should have. So I do give credit for having the guts to go. That being said this is where the "holier than thou" attitude still prevails. That argument is brought up over and over and over and over and over till we all want to puke. There comes a time where it doesn't pertain anymore. I think we are past that, many of your fans don't. It's like us if we kept bringing up being the first University in the state. It happened over 150 years ago, who honestly cares? Then there is this status of sports at D1 level like many of the d2 teams of yesteryear couldn't even compete with these teams. I think that's wrong. My point is putting the letter D and the number 1 behind your schools name doesn't build any base of far better sports programs, only larger and more costlier ones. When the Coyotes played Eastern Washington a few years ago, we had just made the D 1 transition, yet we beat the number one team in FCS like a red headed step child in our Dome with basically D2 recruits. The gal between good D2 teams and FCS teams across the board isn't that large. But many of us felt, myself included, that the SDSU fans made it sound like they were Alabama in football, UCLA in basketball and so on. I guaranty you, you wouldn't have wanted to play the Coyotes when we were D2 and had Logan, and some of the other guys that were pretty incredible athletes for the Coyotes. We would have hung your asses out to dry in the Dome, I guaranty that. Joe Glenn is right. This won't be a rivalry game anymore until we beat you and make it significant. I could honestly care less who you, or your peers view as your rival. For all I care, you can play NDSU 12 times a year ( and you would be 0-12). The ultimate reason that the bantering that goes on is so strong is because deep down everyone knows it is a rivalry game to many. Maybe not all,but certainly to some. And when we finally gain the upper hand on you in football ( and we will) then I can see our fan base saying....this is SDSUs Super Bowl and our main rivalry is UNI. Whatever, it's a stupid argument. Lastly, if this isn't a rivalry,then why on the Bunny Board does a certain poster keep saying all we are are pieces of $hit? Because the dick smack knows it's a rivalry, that's why. HATE STATE If you don't remember the the part in bold,then you have a faulty(convenient) memory. Yotes fans ridiculed SDSU for going D1,saying we would fail,academics would suffer,we would bankrupt our athletic department,etc... I even recall a quote from the USD president saying one of reasons for USD's overwhelming vote to stay D2 was they put emphasis on the "student" in student-athlete.Apparently that mission statement changed a few years later. |
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Post by yotemeal on Nov 20, 2014 11:21:50 GMT -6
Posts from "Yotes": "I've got my tickets (not sure why we went through the trouble of getting tickets when all that's keeping us out is a dinky chain link fence). Never been to a game up there, can't say I'm excited to experience their "stadium" either." "I believe we are set to go check out the practice facility, some sort of pre-game ordeal I guess. Sounds like the weather is going to be about as good as one can expect on Saturday, otherwise I'd probably be hanging out in there just to get away from the cold." Yotes (not the group, the poster): You do not seem very happy about going to the last USD vs. SDSU football game at the wornout and tired Coughlin Alumni Stadium. Visiting fans have been having a great time at all the games this year...even last Saturday's snow bowl. But, judging from the two posts quoted above, you have to reconsider your decision to go to Brookings. Is somebody holding a gun to your head? Stay home and enjoy whatever it is you prefer to do. If you do decide to attend the game, lighten up and have some fun. You will not be forced to go through any pre-game ordeal (how do you come up with such goofy notions?)...you won't be forced to do anything. Present yourself as a reasonable person and you'll be treated as such.
Yoteforever: are you coming up? The 1978 USD defense featuring you and your colleagues, the notorious "Pack Patrol", can revisit the scene of the crime in your championship year: USD 24, SDSU 7 before it is permanently changed. Yotemeal; Cousin Eddie: You seems to be able to find free beer...coming up? We'll have lots of it. Jeff will be there. I've been known to sniff out a free beer from time to time. Looking forward to stopping by. |
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Post by coyotecrazie5 on Nov 20, 2014 12:09:59 GMT -6
 Jersey combo for Sat. |
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91jack
Sophomore Member
Posts: 162
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Post by 91jack on Nov 20, 2014 12:54:09 GMT -6
Im not buying that USD is not a rival of SDSU. They are the only 2 schools in SD at this level of athletics. It is just a saying state fans use to try and degrade the U since the transition. Any true State or U fan knows that the other school is their biggest rival. If they say otherwise they either are not a true fan or started following either school during the transition. I agree 100%. Its a statement they use to degrade U fans. If State does not look at it as a rivalry game then why is this football game and the 2 basketball games against USD the ones with the highest attendence for the year? 2012 Football Game Vs. USD 15,278 Vs. NDSU 14,966 The crowds at SDSU since USD went DI look like this. 10-22-11- NDSU 14,823 11-17-12- USD 15,278 8-28-13- NDSU 16,498 If you look at the top 10 stadium crowds at SDSU there are four for USD and 2 for NDSU. #1. NDSU- 16,498 on 8-28-13 #2. NDSU- 16,345 on11-17-07 #3. USD- 16,193 on 10-19-85 #4. USD- 15,866 on 10-18-75 #8. USD- 15,278 on11-17-12 #10. USD- 15,153 on10-22-77 As you can see NDSU has the top 2 all time attendances and CAS. USD has four games right up there but three of them are from 1985 and before. I hope nobody is arguing that USD was the top rival back then. USD has their 2012 game up there, too. I think that was the game that was on the news for a week leading up to it. The news helps sell these games saying stuff about South Dakota only DI Universities, the Showdown Series, etc... Earlier in the week coach Glenn sounded like it might not be a rivalry game for SDSU but last night on the news he said that "the people up north will have a meltdown is they lose this game"(I think that is the right words). I know that he is correct for that. SDSU fans are having a meltdown because they lost @idaho in the second game of the MBB season. This football game will knock SDSU out of the playoffs. USD>>>>Idaho! Playoffs>>>>2nd game of the season! I don't think it matters who SDSU would lose to, if they don't come through in the last game of the season with it all on the line. The SDSU-USD rivalry will come back it will just take a while. Regardless of who wins, the winning team will have fans that get cocky. I think both teams have many more great fans than "bad apples" but you normally hear the negative much more than the positive. I think that is a positive from the NDSU-SDSU rivalry. There hasn't been as much crap flying (yet) to make it a negative thing to be a part of. That's the way the USD-SDSU and UND-NDSU rivalries were. I hear that they are only expecting 11,000 or so fans on Saturday. I don't know if that is still the case or not but there might be lots of seat available if you want to show up and see the old "high school" stadium for the last time. |
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Post by jimmyjack on Nov 20, 2014 12:59:53 GMT -6
Jersey combo for Sat. A. I think it IS our top rivalry game. I think some people are confusing "rivalry" and "benchmark". NDSU is the benchmark everyone needs to aspire to in FCS football and they were our partners in the D1 move. So, yes, I very much want to bet them. But USD is our historical, in-state rival. I want SDSU to beat everyone we play. But it would definitely "hurt" a lot more to lose to the Yotes. Isn't that emotional aspect key to any rivalry? B. Those uniforms are super cool. |
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Post by yote14 on Nov 20, 2014 13:16:25 GMT -6
Jackjd
I can entertain your claim for basketball games that more USD fans would travel for a game compared to NDSU. But how many USD fans are really at the basketball games in Brookings? not that many. Maybe 5% of the total attendance. Just like the games in Vermillion are 95% red if not more. At least the last 2 years they have been. And that has even been the past few years when USD was a huge underdog in those games.
The football game is off the table. If you say that more USD fans travel to Brookings for the game than NDSU fans you are crazy. I'm not sure there is anyone left in Fargo on gamedays that they are on the road. especially when it's the closest away game for them all year like Brookings is. There was just simply more SDSU fans at the USD game in Brookings for football than there was NDSU.
I'm not buying that argument in basketball either. Unless you want to tell me in 2011/2012 there were over 3,000 USD fans in Brookings which is what it would take to make your George W. Bush math work out on your theory.
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ctc2010
Sophomore Member
Posts: 238 
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Post by ctc2010 on Nov 20, 2014 18:11:15 GMT -6
Jackjd I can entertain your claim for basketball games that more USD fans would travel for a game compared to NDSU. But how many USD fans are really at the basketball games in Brookings? not that many. Maybe 5% of the total attendance. Just like the games in Vermillion are 95% red if not more. At least the last 2 years they have been. And that has even been the past few years when USD was a huge underdog in those games. The football game is off the table. If you say that more USD fans travel to Brookings for the game than NDSU fans you are crazy. I'm not sure there is anyone left in Fargo on gamedays that they are on the road. especially when it's the closest away game for them all year like Brookings is. There was just simply more SDSU fans at the USD game in Brookings for football than there was NDSU. I'm not buying that argument in basketball either. Unless you want to tell me in 2011/2012 there were over 3,000 USD fans in Brookings which is what it would take to make your George W. Bush math work out on your theory. No way is 95% of the crowd at USD/SDSU games in Vermillion red. I'd guess around 65/35ish. |
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Post by Yotes on Nov 20, 2014 18:58:16 GMT -6
Jackjd I can entertain your claim for basketball games that more USD fans would travel for a game compared to NDSU. But how many USD fans are really at the basketball games in Brookings? not that many. Maybe 5% of the total attendance. Just like the games in Vermillion are 95% red if not more. At least the last 2 years they have been. And that has even been the past few years when USD was a huge underdog in those games. The football game is off the table. If you say that more USD fans travel to Brookings for the game than NDSU fans you are crazy. I'm not sure there is anyone left in Fargo on gamedays that they are on the road. especially when it's the closest away game for them all year like Brookings is. There was just simply more SDSU fans at the USD game in Brookings for football than there was NDSU. I'm not buying that argument in basketball either. Unless you want to tell me in 2011/2012 there were over 3,000 USD fans in Brookings which is what it would take to make your George W. Bush math work out on your theory. No way is 95% of the crowd at USD/SDSU games in Vermillion red. I'd guess around 65/35ish. And no way is it 65/35ish |
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 663
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Post by jackjd on Nov 20, 2014 19:08:52 GMT -6
Posts from "Yotes": "I've got my tickets (not sure why we went through the trouble of getting tickets when all that's keeping us out is a dinky chain link fence). Never been to a game up there, can't say I'm excited to experience their "stadium" either." "I believe we are set to go check out the practice facility, some sort of pre-game ordeal I guess. Sounds like the weather is going to be about as good as one can expect on Saturday, otherwise I'd probably be hanging out in there just to get away from the cold." Yotes (not the group, the poster): You do not seem very happy about going to the last USD vs. SDSU football game at the wornout and tired Coughlin Alumni Stadium. Visiting fans have been having a great time at all the games this year...even last Saturday's snow bowl. But, judging from the two posts quoted above, you have to reconsider your decision to go to Brookings. Is somebody holding a gun to your head? Stay home and enjoy whatever it is you prefer to do. If you do decide to attend the game, lighten up and have some fun. You will not be forced to go through any pre-game ordeal (how do you come up with such goofy notions?)...you won't be forced to do anything. Present yourself as a reasonable person and you'll be treated as such.
Yoteforever: are you coming up? The 1978 USD defense featuring you and your colleagues, the notorious "Pack Patrol", can revisit the scene of the crime in your championship year: USD 24, SDSU 7 before it is permanently changed. Yotemeal; Cousin Eddie: You seems to be able to find free beer...coming up? We'll have lots of it. Jeff will be there. I've been known to sniff out a free beer from time to time. Looking forward to stopping by. We'll have 'em...usual location. And which SDSU fans are saying there's NO rivalry between SDSU and USD. I keep reading that on this message board and I don't recall seeing that being written, at least not in recent times, by SDSU fans. And if a few SDSU fans are claiming there's no rivalry and posters here want to judge all SDSU fans by the comments of one or two or a few (applies to me too), then let's get out the coyotefan brush and start painting a broad picture of USD fandom. |
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jackjd
Senior Member
Posts: 663
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Post by jackjd on Nov 20, 2014 19:20:00 GMT -6
Jackjd I can entertain your claim for basketball games that more USD fans would travel for a game compared to NDSU. But how many USD fans are really at the basketball games in Brookings? not that many. Maybe 5% of the total attendance. Just like the games in Vermillion are 95% red if not more. At least the last 2 years they have been. And that has even been the past few years when USD was a huge underdog in those games. The football game is off the table. If you say that more USD fans travel to Brookings for the game than NDSU fans you are crazy. I'm not sure there is anyone left in Fargo on gamedays that they are on the road. especially when it's the closest away game for them all year like Brookings is. There was just simply more SDSU fans at the USD game in Brookings for football than there was NDSU. I'm not buying that argument in basketball either. Unless you want to tell me in 2011/2012 there were over 3,000 USD fans in Brookings which is what it would take to make your George W. Bush math work out on your theory. You'll have to go back and read my post again. Oh, and interesting argument about football: challenge one to make a claim and then show why the claim, which wasn't made, is all wrong. I guess you win -- and lose -- your own argument with yourself.  |
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